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Who says I want IN? :)

Yes... the gates will eliminate those stores as egress routes. So be it. I won't waste any time trying to get them to open. File that under, "DUH!"

It's simply not a factor in my decision to go look for my family. Yes, I realize that it reduces the number of possible exits. Again... so be it. I don't see how it's relevant to the (rather obvious no-brainer to me) decision to actively seek and protect my family. I am NOT going to go HIDE or RUN AWAY from my own family (and hope they fair well on their own) in a SHTF situation. Your mileage may vary. :dunno
Be that as it may... if I was separated (not likely) from my family, I'm going in. It's a very easy decision without any regard to any store's policy of closing the gate.

You said you were going in? Read your own quoted words above. ‘I’m going in.’
Hence my question? Maybe I misunderstood your meaning? But it sure sounded like you said you were going to enter the store no matter what? Stores are huge. You may be in one and your family in another. SHTF and the gates close to eliminate access to the possible bad guy. So now what? You’re stuck outside and your family is stuck inside a store with a closed gate. IF and when I ever go to the mall with my wife (which is NEVER) I’m not following her around Macy’s. I’ll be elsewhere looking at stuff I like while she wonders around aimlessly.
 

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Discussion Starter #42
You said you were going in? Read your own quoted words above. ‘I’m going in.’
Hence my question? Maybe I misunderstood your meaning? But it sure sounded like you said you were going to enter the store no matter what? Stores are huge. You may be in one and your family in another. SHTF and the gates close to eliminate access to the possible bad guy. So now what? You’re stuck outside and your family is stuck inside a store with a closed gate. IF and when I ever go to the mall with my wife (which is NEVER) I’m not following her around Macy’s. I’ll be elsewhere looking at stuff I like while she wonders around aimlessly.
Oy. Geez. OK.... By "going in," I mean going AFTER my family (should we be separated)... into the thick of things, not going INTO a store.

So... we're in a mall. Somehow, I'm separated from my family (unlikely). The SHTF. I'm NOT going to look for the nearest exit in this case (as I would if I was by myself). Instead, I'm going "hunting" for my family, which may mean going the OPPOSITE way.

Earlier in the conversation, we talked about the fastest way out (exit) being going through the back of a store. Then a comment was made that, if I was to go looking for my family, some of those stores will likely close the doors / gates, which would preclude those points of egress. To which I replied, "so what?" If my family is elsewhere, I'm going looking for them rather than trying to find the nearest / fastest exit.

So, in other words, the fact that the stores will all be closing and locking their doors would be irrelevant in the case that my family has become separated. GTFO becomes a SECONDARY mission, if my family is there and separated. If I'm by myself, it's the primary mission.

So, yeah... if I'm hunting for my family, I'm not going INTO a store. If my family is not with me, I'm going "IN" to the thick of the $hit (if I have to) in order to find them. At that point, I don't care that the stores (alternative points of egress) are locking down.

Again, your mileage and priorities may vary. :)
 

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The stores in malls (most) have roll down gates. Good luck ‘going in’ or getting them to open them up for you a non leo non uniformed person. How do you figure to accomplish that?
You have a gun don't you? :rofl
 

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Oy. Geez. OK.... By "going in," I mean going AFTER my family (should we be separated)... into the thick of things, not going INTO a store.

So... we're in a mall. Somehow, I'm separated from my family (unlikely). The SHTF. I'm NOT going to look for the nearest exit in this case (as I would if I was by myself). Instead, I'm going "hunting" for my family, which may mean going the OPPOSITE way.

Earlier in the conversation, we talked about the fastest way out (exit) being going through the back of a store. Then a comment was made that, if I was to go looking for my family, some of those stores will likely close the doors / gates, which would preclude those points of egress. To which I replied, "so what?" If my family is elsewhere, I'm going looking for them rather than trying to find the nearest / fastest exit.

So, in other words, the fact that the stores will all be closing and locking their doors would be irrelevant in the case that my family has become separated. GTFO becomes a SECONDARY mission, if my family is there and separated. If I'm by myself, it's the primary mission.

So, yeah... if I'm hunting for my family, I'm not going INTO a store. If my family is not with me, I'm going "IN" to the thick of the $hit (if I have to) in order to find them. At that point, I don't care that the stores (alternative points of egress) are locking down.

Again, your mileage and priorities may vary. :)
My phone is acting up so I can’t bold certain things but address my question.
Yeah you’re ‘going into the thick of things’ looking for them. But the stores are not points of egress they would be points of entry for anyone and that’s why the gates would be rolled down, to prevent that. Everyone inside is now either sheltered in place or already exited thru back/front/facing door to the outside. Not all stores have doors that actually exit the main mall, only some do. So you’re OUT of the store and your family is in one of them. You’re separated by the now rolled down locked gate. What are you going to do?
You’re last sentence isn’t making sense. You’re going to find them yet you don’t care if the stores are locking down? How are you going to accomplish that?
 

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Discussion Starter #48
My phone is acting up so I can’t bold certain things but address my question.
Yeah you’re ‘going into the thick of things’ looking for them. But the stores are not points of egress they would be points of entry for anyone and that’s why the gates would be rolled down, to prevent that. Everyone inside is now either sheltered in place or already exited thru back/front/facing door to the outside. Not all stores have doors that actually exit the main mall, only some do. So you’re OUT of the store and your family is in one of them. You’re separated by the now rolled down locked gate. What are you going to do?
You’re last sentence isn’t making sense. You’re going to find them yet you don’t care if the stores are locking down? How are you going to accomplish that?
We're having two different conversations here. But, I don't think I'll make any more effort to explain what I think is a very simple concept. You're misinterpreting what I've written (to suit your perspective, apparently). I will just say that it appears we have different priorities and tactics as it pertains to protecting our families. Different strokes.
 

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We're having two different conversations here. But, I don't think I'll make any more effort to explain what I think is a very simple concept. You're misinterpreting what I've written (to suit your perspective, apparently). I will just say that it appears we have different priorities and tactics as it pertains to protecting our families. Different strokes.
No, you’re dancing around simple questions that I asked you.
To say you’re going into the thick of things to find your family yet you don’t care about gates makes no sense. You’re out in the hallway. They are inside a store. You’re separated by the now rolled down gate. How are you going to accomplish rejoining them?
Its a simple scenario and simple question. You don’t wanna answer it that’s fine.

I understand you would seek to rejoin them. All of us would want to do the same.
I’m just trying to figure out how you’d solve my above scenario is all.
 

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Discussion Starter #50 (Edited)
No, you’re dancing around simple questions that I asked you.
To say you’re going into the thick of things to find your family yet you don’t care about gates makes no sense. You’re out in the hallway. They are inside a store. You’re separated by the now rolled down gate. How are you going to accomplish rejoining them?
Its a simple scenario and simple question. You don’t wanna answer it that’s fine.

I understand you would seek to rejoin them. All of us would want to do the same.
I’m just trying to figure out how you’d solve my above scenario is all.
I'll spell it out as simply as I know how....

If I am separated from my family in a SHTF situation (again not likely, but for the sake of the discussion), I am NOT going to "shelter in place" and hope they're OK. I'm NOT staying put. I will not obey any orders to stay put. WILL NOT. Any complications that occur along the way... I'll address as I go along, including your scenario.

But, I'm not staying put. You go ahead and stay put. That's your choice. Not mine, though. Your hypothetical scenario does not change my mind about my decision to move rather than shelter and hope. It is not an effective argument against my strategy. So, your scenario is irrelevant to my predetermined decision to move and try to find my family.

If I'm alone, it's also unlikely that I will "shelter in place" in the mall. I'm going to most likely GTFO. I won't be a fish in a barrel, even if "ordered" to do so.

I don't expect that everyone will agree with my approach. That's OK. To each their own. Personally... I couldn't live with myself if I stayed put while knowing my family is "out there" in a SHTF situation. I guess I'm weird that way. :)
 

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I'll spell it out as simple as I know how....

If I am separated from my family in a SHTF situation (again not likely, but for the sake of the discussion), I am NOT going to "shelter in place" and hope they're OK. I'm NOT staying put. I will not obey any orders to stay put. WILL NOT. Any complications that occur along the way... I'll address as I go along, including your scenario.

But, I'm not staying put. You go ahead and stay put. That's your choice. Not mine, though. Your hypothetical scenario does not change my mind about my decision to move rather than shelter and hope. It is not an effective argument against my strategy. So, your scenario is irrelevant to my predetermined decision to move and try to find my family.

If I'm alone, it's also unlikely that I will "shelter in place" in the mall. I'm going to most likely GTFO. I won't be a fish in a barrel, even if "ordered" to do so.

I don't expect that everyone will agree with my approach. That's OK. To each their own.
Good grief.....
Show me where I said I’d stay put other than when I was being sarcastic about getting some free pizza?
I agreed with you in the effort to not stay put and rejoin your family.
Yet you still have not answered the simple question.
In your refusal to stay put and in your attempt to rejoin your family you realize you’re now separated by a freshly rolled down gate.
HOW ARE YOU GOING TO REJOIN YOUR FAMILY?
Is that clear and simple enough for you to answer?
 

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Discussion Starter #52
Good grief.....
Show me where I said I’d stay put other than when I was being sarcastic about getting some free pizza?
I agreed with you in the effort to not stay put and rejoin your family.
Yet you still have not answered the simple question.
In your refusal to stay put and in your attempt to rejoin your family you realize you’re now separated by a freshly rolled down gate.
HOW ARE YOU GOING TO REJOIN YOUR FAMILY?
Is that clear and simple enough for you to answer?
The question is pointless and irrelevant. Nevertheless, I just answered your question above. I'll deal with that possibility WHEN I GET THERE. That possibility changes NOTHING about my decision to go on the move to find them.

To answer your question as bluntly as possible: Who gives a f**k if there is a gate there when I find them?? I found them! Mission accomplished. If the gate is locked, then I'll find cover (if possible) and stand guard until it isn't locked. But, I'll likely instruct them to leave the store out the back... and to knock the $hit out of anyone who tries to stop them.

What is your point? Seriously... what IS your point here? Are you trying to refute my position or strategy? What would you do differently?

That all said and SETTLED (as far as I'm concerned), there's a pretty good chance we'll have "comms," too (everyone has a cell phone). "Dad, we're locked in at the GAP store." Or, "We escaped out of the mall through the food court and are out in the parking lot now." I will proceed accordingly. But, I'm not staying put.

To me, this is binary. You either stay put, or you move. So, any hypotheticals beyond that are matters of contingency, but they don't change my decision to MOVE.
 

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To answer your question as bluntly as possible: Who gives a f**k if there is a gate there when I find them?? I found them! Mission accomplished. If the gate is locked, then I'll find cover (if possible) and stand guard until it isn't locked. But, I'll likely instruct them to leave the store out the back... and to knock the $hit out of anyone who tries to stop them
Why it took three times being asked the same to get that simple answer I don’t know?
I have no point and would do the same as you. Was only asking about one specific aspect.
That’s ALL...

And since your name is Racer and you ‘hit it first’ I’m sure you’d find them pretty quickly. :rofl
 

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Just in case you missed it, the scare ended up being caused by a cleaning guy popping a balloon! Great discussion though.
 

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Just in case you missed it, the scare ended up being caused by a cleaning guy popping a balloon! Great discussion though.
And if that was not enough fake news for the week, the bomb that exploded at the Montana school wasn't...

Montana authorities say a device they initially thought to be the remnants of a homemade bomb in an elementary school playground didn't explode – and it wasn't even a bomb.

Lewis and Clark County Sheriff Leo Dutton said Tuesday that further investigation found the plastic bottle wrapped in black tape was full of washers, nuts and bolts, along with a non-flammable unidentified liquid. There was no detonator attached to the bottle.

Dutton says a homeless person carried the bottle from a nearby construction site and left it in Helena's Rossiter Elementary School playground.

Initially, authorities said the bottle was an improvised explosive device that detonated sometime before school began. Dutton says authorities passed on information they believed to be true at the time, and that school officials acted appropriately.

:dunno
 

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^^^^
:doh
 
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