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You must act quickly. PLEASE IMMEDIATELY E-MAIL members of the Senate Criminal Justice Committee. THEY NEED TO HEAR FROM YOU NOW!

In the subject line put:

SUPPORT SB 432 -- Stop Doctors from Violating Gun Privacy Rights

http://www.nraila.org/Legislation/Read.aspx?ID=6269

**URGENT ROUND 3 ** STOP Doctors from Violating Patients’ Gun Privacy Rights in Florida

DATE: February 16, 2011
TO: USF & NRA Members and Friends
FROM: Marion P. Hammer
USF Executive Director
NRA Past President

Senate Bill 432, introduced by state Senator Greg Evers (R-2) has been scheduled to be heard in the Senate Criminal Justice Committee on Tuesday, February 22 at 9:00 a.m.

SB 432 would stop anti-gun doctors from asking children and parents if they own guns and then telling them to get rid of their guns. It further stops doctors from denying care to children if the parents refuse to answer questions about gun ownership.

This bill is designed to make doctors practice medicine NOT practice gun ban politics in their examination rooms. As a parent or a patient you have a right to protect your privacy about gun ownership. How many guns you own and where they are stored is your personal private information.

The American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) is pushing its anti-gun agenda of banning and removing guns from homes in Florida.

You must act quickly. PLEASE IMMEDIATELY E-MAIL members of the Senate Criminal Justice Committee. THEY NEED TO HEAR FROM YOU NOW!

In the subject line put:

SUPPORT SB 432 -- Stop Doctors from Violating Gun Privacy Rights

(Block and Copy All email addresses into the "Send To" box)

[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected]

BACKGROUND
Doctors need to treat illness, not guns. Pediatricians and other physicians, in growing numbers, are prying into our personal lives, invading our privacy and straying from issues relating to disease and medicine by questioning children or their parents about gun ownership.

We take our children to physicians for medical care, not moral judgment, political harassment and privacy intrusions - and that is what SB 432 intends to prohibit.

This bill comes in answer to families who are complaining about the growing political agenda being carried out in examination rooms by doctors and medical staffs - and the arrogant berating if a patient refuses to answer questions that violate privacy rights and offend common decency.

Horrified parents have described nurses entering the answers to gun questions into laptop computers to become a part of medical records. Parents have become concerned about whether those records can be used by the government or by insurance companies to deny health care coverage because a family exercises a civil right in owning firearms.

The American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) and the American Medical Association are pushing this gun ban agenda. The website of the AAP makes it clear its goal is to ban guns and to prevent parents from having guns in their homes or vehicles.

The intent of some may be to stop death from firearms accidents, but it is worth noting that, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention's National Center for Health Statistics, doctors and medical staffs in Florida are responsible for six times more accidental deaths (called "Medical Misadventures") than firearms accidents. Physicians have plenty of room to work in their own backyards to stop accidental deaths in keeping with their "first do no harm" medical oaths.

Keeping children and families safe is a worthy goal, but physicians should focus on what happens to children and patients in their offices and hospitals. Doctors should practice medicine rather than behave like social workers, gun monitors or gun registration bureaus.

As parents, we are responsible for our children's safety. We don't need doctors pushing their anti-gun politics on us or our children. We need them to spend their time practicing medicine and not prying into our personal lives on issues that have nothing to do with disease, its cure, or its eradication.

Imagine how you would react if this happened to someone in your family:



A Mom took her toddler to their pediatrician, who had been the child's pediatrician since he was born.



Out of the clear, the pediatrician asked if she or her husband owned any guns. She was shocked and responded by asking, "Do YOU own a gun?"


He told her that whether or not HE owned a gun was none of her business. She responded by saying "right back at you." The doctor got angry and walked out of the room.


The mom waited for 30 minutes before a nurse came in and said the doctor wasn't coming back so she could leave. She dressed her son and left without the child ever being examined.


The doctor’s office sent her a bill, because she walked out without paying. She wouldn't pay the bill because the doctor walked out without examining her child.


The bill was turned over to a collection agency. The collection agency started harassing the family and threatening their credit.


Her husband hired a lawyer. The doctor told the lawyer it was all the Mom's fault, because she wouldn't answer his question and as a doctor, he had a right to ask any "damn" thing he wanted to.




The doctor's lawyer then got involved and advised the doctor to cancel the bill and apologize to the family. The doctor canceled the bill, but never apologized. Then told the family to find a new doctor.

The many horror stories out there are unconscionable.

We know that many doctors don't interrogate their patients about what private personal property they own. This bill is not about them. SB 432 is about stopping the anti-gun doctors who violate privacy rights, try to offer unsolicited political advice to patients and become abusive when patients refuse to be bullied.

Please read the opinion of Dr. Timothy Wheeler with Doctors for Responsible Gun Ownership at the Claremont Institute, Doctor’s Office Not the Place for Anti-Gun Politics in the Sun Sentinel. You can read the article by clicking here.
 

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This is when you tell your kids, if a Doctor ask you if your daddy has a gun, just tell the Doctor to "Shut the : censored up" and exam me or were going to find a Doctor who minds there own : censored business. :grin
 

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Doctor doesn't think you should own a gun -- doctor doesn't get any of your money. This could be a bonanza for doctors that mind there own business and just treat patients like they took an oath to do.
 

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This is when you tell your kids, if a Doctor ask you if your daddy has a gun, just tell the Doctor to "Shut the : censored up" and exam me or were going to find a Doctor who minds there own : censored business. :grin
That wouldnt be a problem for my little princess! lol
 

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Kids have been trained on responses, plus I am always with them. Will send letters out. Scumbags, I hate this kind of crap wasting my days.
 

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For a group of people who rail against any laws that inhibit their freedoms, some people here sure are quick to back laws that inhibit other people's freedoms. They want to force people to allow firearms carry on private property and now they want to force private citizens not to ask certain questions or bring up certain topics. Sounds kinda authoritarian to me. If a government can arbitrarily infringe upon the 1st Amendment, it can further ignore the 2nd.

Look, doctors are not government agents; at least not yet. You have the option to refuse to answer any question posed to you by a doctor. There is no need for a law restricting what a physician can ask a patient.

But, for the terminally paranoid out there, let's take this step further. Why stop with restricting questions about firearms? How about swimming pools? What if the AAP compiled a list of swimming pool owners? How about questions about household chemical storage? What about seat belt usage? Or any of a hundred other things or conditions that can lead to the accidental death of a child? The AAP has no real power. They can not mandate that a person do anything, nor are they a legislative body that can force people to do anything. And, a patient has the right to refuse to answer any question placed to them by a doctor.
 

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What your missing Mac45 is the Doctors are charging you for the visit if you say yes, I understand all you have to do is say no but I find it hard to believe that Doctors should be asking these questions. I for one would walk out and find another one, plus would never let a kid be alone with a doctor so you could intervine if something was to happen. I don't have kids but I spend time with my nephews and my sister never leaves them alone with a doctor or anyone but family. So I guess what your saying Mac45 is refuse, so does this mean you have to ask the nurse when making a first time appointment if the doctor asks these type of questions and if you refuse, do you get charged? Seems like a law making doctors do ther job and leave there personal feelings out of it is a lot easier. Maybe just a law to stop them from charging you? :rolleyes:
 

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I am torn on this one as I do not believe that doctors have any legitimate reason to ask the question; however, I also do not like any law that infringes upon our rights as individuals. As for the doctor charging you, I see that as a non-issue. You may get charged once, but you will never go back again. If you tell all of your gun owning friends about the incident, the doctor loses business and eventually has to close his practice. The only place I could see this as a real issue would be a hospital or emergency room. If they had a policy of asking these types of questions, you may not have alternatives available to you.

In the end, I am just not sure that I can support this bill, but am open to hear more information about it and could change my mind.
 

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What your missing Mac45 is the Doctors are charging you for the visit if you say yes, I understand all you have to do is say no but I find it hard to believe that Doctors should be asking these questions. I for one would walk out and find another one, plus would never let a kid be alone with a doctor so you could intervine if something was to happen. I don't have kids but I spend time with my nephews and my sister never leaves them alone with a doctor or anyone but family. So I guess what your saying Mac45 is refuse, so does this mean you have to ask the nurse when making a first time appointment if the doctor asks these type of questions and if you refuse, do you get charged? Seems like a law making doctors do ther job and leave there personal feelings out of it is a lot easier. Maybe just a law to stop them from charging you? :rolleyes:
Let me make my position clear on this. The doctor is a private individual. He is not an agent of the government. You have no obligation to answer any question put to you by a private person. Just say no. Now what you, and others, want to do is make it a crime for a private person to ask a question. This is a very slippery slope. Where does it end? Should it be a crime for a landlord to ask a prospective tenant if they have a dog? Or, to reverse this, how about making it a illegal for a patient to ask if a doctor is certified to practice medicine in this state? How about making it illegal to ask if your child has had his vaccinations, or if he uses a seat belt or lives in a house with a pool? Where does it stop?

For some reason, certain firearms advocates have hopped on the "let's make it illegal" band wagon. The very same band wagon that they have been trying to dismantle for decades. You can't have it both ways. You are either for freedom or against it. If you support curtailing free speech, then you can't complain about others curtailing your right to keep and bear arms. This bill is simply a reaction to the paranoia of some gun owners.
 

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Good points but something should be done to prevent a doctor from charging you after he refused to see you. That's the part that gets me.
 

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My doctor usually asks if i want to see his new "baby".
 

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Well it might be a reaction Mac45, I just didn't like the asking part and charging part of this. It's not any of the doctors business as to compare with a landlord and dog , thats a whole different issue because the dog can do damage to the landlords property, what damage can be personally done to the doctor? I do agree that there is a bit of nit picking but only in reaction of anti-guns laws, yes it's a power play but I don't think this will go as far as your thinking but thats just my opinion. Oh well will see what happens. And btw I'm too sick and don't have time between my appointments to get involved with too many groups. I'm just responding to the thread, I'm not writing my Represenitves in support of this, I only like the portions I pointed out and with most laws there is give and take. :rolleyes:
 

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Good points but something should be done to prevent a doctor from charging you after he refused to see you. That's the part that gets me.
Legally, if a doctor refuses to provide services, he is going to have a hard time justifying charging you. In the article, when the doctor charged for the office visit after he refused to treat the patient or contnue the examination, his attorney told him to cancel the charge and apologize. This is not unique to the medical profession. Charging for services not performed is a problem in every profession and service industry, from plumbers, to auto mechanics, to contractors, to doctors. There are already plenty of saeguards and remedies available to deal with any problems, of this type, that might arise.

CapeTeddy: "Well it might be a reaction Mac45, I just didn't like the asking part and charging part of this. It's not any of the doctors business as to compare with a landlord and dog , thats a whole different issue because the dog can do damage to the landlords property, what damage can be personally done to the doctor? I do agree that there is a bit of nit picking but only in reaction of anti-guns laws, yes it's a power play but I don't think this will go as far as your thinking but thats just my opinion. Oh well will see what happens. And btw I'm too sick and don't have time between my appointments to get involved with too many groups. I'm just responding to the thread, I'm not writing my Represenitves in support of this, I only like the portions I pointed out and with most laws there is give and take. "

Teddy,

I agree that this bill probably won't go anywhere. But, that is not the point. The point is that the people who cry the loudest about their "rights" and the criminalization of practices that cause people little or no direct harm, seem very eager to criminalize the "rights" of another because they don't like a question or a statement. They are actually indulging in the same totalitarian behavior as those they decry.
 

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Legally, if a doctor refuses to provide services, he is going to have a hard time justifying charging you. In the article, when the doctor charged for the office visit after he refused to treat the patient or contnue the examination, his attorney told him to cancel the charge and apologize. This is not unique to the medical profession. Charging for services not performed is a problem in every profession and service industry, from plumbers, to auto mechanics, to contractors, to doctors. There are already plenty of saeguards and remedies available to deal with any problems, of this type, that might arise.
Understood. However, I cannot afford to hire an attorney. In fact, the bill would probably be cheaper to pay. Even if I did, most doctors could financially afford to fight it if they didn't give up after that. With a plumber or something I could possibly handle it myself, as, in general, the local plumber isn't as well off as a doctor. I know there are some plumbers that make a fortune but this is not the intent of the comparison. You know how it is, he with the most money usually wins. OJ isn't a murderer and Michael Jackson isn't a kiddie-diddler.
 

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For the record, I could really give two sh!ts about this, I'm just debating it with you for fun. I support pretty much anything that is pro-gun but I generally won't go any further than sending an email unless it is something along the likes of the campus/open carry or penalties for violating preemption bills. Does that make sense? Anyway, your turn! :grin
 

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personally...i wouldnt have hired a lawyer....i would have written a nice letter to the medical review board and the doctor...asked the name of his lawyer so i coud discuss it personally with them...i'm pretty sure it would have cleared itself up reasonably quickly...just because the husband hire a lawyer doesnt mean one was necessary nor the ability to pay a lawyer was necessary...in many instances it is just a matter of rattling the right cages and letting them know you are prepared to do battle...

and the doctor is free to ask whatever he pleases...just as you are free to answer whatever you please...thats the part where "freedom" comes in...and if the service isnt satisfactory there are procedures in place for challenging charges...

charging for services not rendere isnt unique to the service industry....its pretty widespread in every facet of business and type of employment and the reason there are so many people who have jobs that they dont perform but still get paid for them...
 

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For the record, I could really give two sh!ts about this, I'm just debating it with you for fun. I support pretty much anything that is pro-gun but I generally won't go any further than sending an email unless it is something along the likes of the campus/open carry or penalties for violating preemption bills. Does that make sense? Anyway, your turn! :grin
I'm for the open carry and that's the only group I belong to. I didn't e-mail on the doctor because I thought it didn't pretain to me since I don't have kids. I didn't think of my fellow group members that do have kids so I might send e-mails in support of them. Besides maybe our pro-gun legislators might want to use this as a tool to say "will drop the doctor bill if you vote for open carry", :rofl, it may work. :rolleyes:
 

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I'm with Mac45 on this; as part of my occupation, I frequently ask people questions that they don't want to answer (or at least answer truthfully). On the rare occasion that somebody gives me the "you can't ask me that" routine, I inform them that I can ask anything I want...and they have the option to refuse to answer.
 
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