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If you haven't read it already, "The Gift of Fear" is a very good book on these warning signs you mention that she noticed in hindsight, and how people often avoid or rationalize these instinctual warnings away.

The author, Gavin de Becker, is fairly anti-gun (and a bit hypocritical), so ignore any of the anti-gun rhetoric he spouts. Except for that, the material in the book is VERY good.

-JT
Ditto. Finished reading it a couple of weeks ago. Agree on all points. And, I believe EVERYONE, but especially women, should read the book.
 

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I always get a kick out of my friends. They ask me about guns and carrying. I don't really push them to go out and buy a gun or get their concealed weapon permit. But if they ask and really want to be serious about it, then I step in and give them all the info they need. As many of you guys on here have said before, "Its a mindset thing". I think you have to be prepared to USE that concealed weapon BEFORE you have to draw it. Most of the time they still have that mindset that :

If someone pisses me off...
If someone insults my wife..
If someone grabs my wife's butt...
If someone kicks my dog....
If someone gets out of their car and tries to get me to fight...
etc...

I try to tell people that normally those are NOT reasons to pull out a gun and shoot someone....but I still hear the same things again.

My biggest thing is, Awareness is the key, and I don't want to ever be in an unjustified shooting trial as the defendant..!
 

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Most of the time they still have that mindset that :

If someone pisses me off...
If someone insults my wife..
If someone grabs my wife's butt...
If someone kicks my dog....
If someone gets out of their car and tries to get me to fight...
etc...

I try to tell people that normally those are NOT reasons to pull out a gun and shoot someone....but I still hear the same things again.

My biggest thing is, Awareness is the key, and I don't want to ever be in an unjustified shooting trial as the defendant..!
I hear the same thing as an objection to CCW. The naive / antis think that CCW equals the reactions your friends (and some of mine) predict. I explain, as you do, that those instances do NOT warrant lethal force (or even such a threat). And, they naively (and in an effort to placate me) reply, "I know YOU won't, but what about all the others?" :rolleyes:
 

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I’ve read this before. I just read it again in its entirety, and I have no doubt I will read it again in the future. You cannot reinforce something this important often enough.

Today I came to the forum looking for specific links to share with my son and I came across this one. I wanted to back the conversation I had with him last night with the opinion of others that have been carrying longer than he and I have. It is funny (not the ha ha kind), because I’ve recently participated in a thread here where I stood my ground on the totality of circumstances dictating the need for a response, that you shouldn’t necessarily wait for that punch before reacting. Last night I found myself telling my son we was about to act prematurely (in my opinion). He explained to me that his last resort in a confrontation would be to reach for his firearm; I argued that his last resort should be to participate in the confrontation at all, thus placing the use of the firearm out of the equation.

We have different mindsets and each of us has to learn to work within the parameters of our mental and emotional make-up. While we both detest injustices toward others we react differently upon observing them. He is more of the protector kind and I more of a defender. In my case, I think you would nearly have to bring the fight (or danger) directly to me or a loved one before I would react. He is young and more impulsive, his heart is in the right place and I don’t want to ever change that, but I want him to be at tad more patient and calculative before he intervenes.

Yesterday I went to the movies with my son and his girlfriend. We agreed to go in the early evening guessing most would still be at home celebrating the 4th, our assumptions were correct. The theater in the mall is on the second floor, as the escalator is reaching the top I notice a group of 5 very boisterous teenage males. It was not just the way they were dressed and being loud that made me stop dead in my tracks to reevaluate, it was the complete package, attitude, choice of words body language and more than what I can actually put into words. For reasons unknown to me, habit I guess, we always turn to the right to walk toward the theater once off the escalator. My son and his girlfriend were one step ahead of me; I just pulled on his shirt and told him “this way!” guiding him toward the left. With my back to the teens I alerted him to the group by the column on the other side.

I had to exercise every ounce of will power to not directly look at the group but be aware of their presence and movements. Will power wasn’t enough when I heard one of them saying loudly “Hey, pretty thing!” as they touched a girl’s hair that was just passing by them. One from the group had taken a step in front of her to prevent her passing. I have no clue what that girl was thinking of or experiencing, but I can tell you my heart was beating loudly and I could feel it echoing in my head. We were far from them but could clearly see and hear it all. Suddenly I see my son take a step away from us and toward them, if my heart had been beating loudly before now it’s about to pop out of my chest! I pulled him back “No, wait!” At this point a zillion things are going through my mind. My son is armed and so am I. If he intervenes I have to intervene as well. He is three times the size of any of those teens and can handle himself well without resorting to the use of his weapon, but what if they’re armed as well? Can he physically take on all 5? I can see the look of pure terror on my son’s girlfriend face, she is looking at me almost pleading that I don’t allow him to take another step in their direction. (I’m forever thankful that in spite the fact both boys are all grown up they still listen to me.) The girl takes one step to the right, the guy moves again in front of her. By this time she is giving loud commands to leave her alone and others have become aware of the situation. She takes another step to the left to walk away and as the guy is about to mirror her step, another from the group grabs him and pulls him toward them allowing the girl safe passage. His friends had become aware that all eyes were on them and it was time to stop their harassment. At that point my son’s body relaxed and he took a step back toward us. Needless to say, it took a while before my heartbeat was back to normal.

Now, to the part I’ll never have an answer for…. What was that girl thinking? She had to have seen them long before she crossed their path, it’s not as if they were just standing there quietly, they had been loud and obnoxious long before she even entered the picture. The area was not packed; it would have been just as easy to go by the other side (as we did).

When my daughter was younger she used to get upset when avoided people just by the way they looked. Her attitude, at the time, was that I shouldn’t assume they weren’t good people just because they dressed differently than I do. Unfortunately, whether you think it’s right or wrong, people do form first impressions based on the way you look; it’s human nature. If the way you look intimidates me in any way I may never take the time to realize that there is a good person behind that less than desirable appearance. Perhaps that girl at the mall thought as my daughter used to think and this time found out she was wrong? I don’t know and I’ll never know. I wish I could ask her.

Those few minutes felt like a lifetime to me. Within seconds of my son taking that step my mind was going over plan A, plan B, plan C and so forth. If he had made it to them and they not backed off and left the girl alone things would have gotten physical. How long would have I allowed him to use physical intimidation or force before I made an armed appearance? Would I have allowed him to take a few punches and hope he could overcome that before intervening? Physically, without the use of his firearm, I believe he could have been victorious in a fight with one, two maybe even three of them….but 5?

Another thing, I believe I misplaced my anger after the stressful event. I found myself angrier with the girl than with the 5 undesirable teens. I saw her as the potential reason for my son and I having spent the 4th of July in jail.

Right or wrong, I’m still angry with that girl and pray yesterday served as a lesson to her to be more aware of her surroundings. Nothing did ultimately happen and I thank God for that, or I might not be sitting at home reading this thread today.

Am I always completely aware of my surroundings? I must be frank and admit that I’m not. In more than one occasion I’ve allowed someone within close proximity before I became aware of their presence. That has happened less since I started carrying, but it has happened. It’s one of those things that I must continuously work on and become better at.

.
 

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I always get a kick out of my friends. They ask me about guns and carrying. I don't really push them to go out and buy a gun or get their concealed weapon permit. But if they ask and really want to be serious about it, then I step in and give them all the info they need. As many of you guys on here have said before, "Its a mindset thing". I think you have to be prepared to USE that concealed weapon BEFORE you have to draw it. Most of the time they still have that mindset that :

If someone pisses me off...
If someone insults my wife..
If someone grabs my wife's butt...
If someone kicks my dog....
If someone gets out of their car and tries to get me to fight...
etc...

I try to tell people that normally those are NOT reasons to pull out a gun and shoot someone....but I still hear the same things again.

My biggest thing is, Awareness is the key, and I don't want to ever be in an unjustified shooting trial as the defendant..!
my responses to that would be "do you really believe i wouldnt have already shot someone if any of those reasons were enough to do so?"....thos eare about as ridiculous as they come...or..."youve already pissed me off and i havent shot you yet."...or..."would you shoot someone for any of those things? if so i can see why you dont carry a gun. you are too violent."...
 

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my responses to that would be "do you really believe i wouldnt have already shot someone if any of those reasons were enough to do so?"....thos eare about as ridiculous as they come...or..."youve already pissed me off and i havent shot you yet."...or..."would you shoot someone for any of those things? if so i can see why you dont carry a gun. you are too violent."...
:rofl I like those responses! I must keep them in mind. I'm currently torn between:

“youve already pissed me off and i havent shot you yet." and

“i can see why you dont carry a gun. you are too violent”

I think I’ll opt for the last one. :)
 

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Attempted rape

[He pulled the man off of my niece and they then went at it. The man ran away with my niece's friend chasing after him. He did manage to throw a lawn chair at him but he still got away. /QUOTE]

Ladies and Gentlemen, as you know "I am not from round here!" fighting with people, single, or 4 or five men, certain rules apply.

Anybody on the ground, who is raping, strangling, holding with left hand, hitting with right, it is the same problem. Once you grapple, grip or hold, it is now a contact sport, four feet pushing and shoving, no, no and no!

From one who was stabbed in the back pulling one young guy off an other young chap, on the ground/floor in a Night Club, my back was to the crowd, me the enemy (Bouncer) had some one stick a small knife, or nail file in my back, to the left of my right kidney. The Dr. in the Em-erg. Dept. said they were right handed, if they had been left handed, more serious.

You come in from behind, use a weapon, whatever is lying about, strike for the side of the head (as hard as the H+++ you can hit!) or with no weapons available, kick for the kidney, like you are trying for a field goal.

If they are heavy, fat or muscle, that helps transmit shock.

If you are made to come in from the head side, terrain, furniture, proximity to vehicle, etc, the attacker is not able to move too much, he is low to the ground, both hands busy.

The kick is a lifting kick, aimed for the center of the face, under the nose is good. If you are armed, contact shot to the temple, you are covered here in Florida, reference the law.

The focus of this post is the attempted rape posted already. Anybody who thinks a rape is just a sexual crime? You are mental! A rape is the most heinous of crimes, some woman never recover from a rape.

Lesson here, do not grapple, do not lose your mobility. Use all the power you can muster, it is about winning.
 

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Misty,

This is something I just re read, (wide awake, me, the rest of the world asleep!)
When my daughter was younger she used to get upset when avoided people just by the way they looked. Her attitude, at the time, was that I shouldn't assume they weren’t good people just because they dressed differently than I do.
That is the youth speaking! When you have been around a while, like over 50 years or so, you start to see patterns in life, one of them being people dress a certain way, because they are sending out a message, a message they wanted to send out, it was not an accident.

The least you can do is field that message, and proceed from there, with caution.
 

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Misty,

This is something I just re read, (wide awake, me, the rest of the world asleep!)


That is the youth speaking! When you have been around a while, like over 50 years or so, you start to see patterns in life, one of them being people dress a certain way, because they are sending out a message, a message they wanted to send out, it was not an accident.

The least you can do is field that message, and proceed from there, with caution.
She’s outgrown that opinion, she will soon be 29 and her biggest and loudest complaint is that she’s turning into me. God does have a fantastic and twisted sense of humor!:grin
 

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Bump for information in thread.
 

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Thanks for the bump Red Dawg. Great read, I can think of a couple of people I must share this with.
 

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Thank you for posting this. I have always been a little on the paranoid side but I'm noticing a lot more now.

my responses to that would be "do you really believe i wouldnt have already shot someone if any of those reasons were enough to do so?"....thos eare about as ridiculous as they come...or..."youve already pissed me off and i havent shot you yet."...or..."would you shoot someone for any of those things? if so i can see why you dont carry a gun. you are too violent."...
I really like your answers. I might have to use a couple one day :) . Someone close to me told me I couldn't go to her house if I was carrying because she has kids there and it's not safe. My reply? "Ok out of respect for your feelings, I will be more than happy to make lunch plans with you somewhere from now on". Really, if someone armed breaks into my home, I don't think they they really care about the safety of my toddler.

Misty02- Thank you for posting what happened at the mall. I will admit that sometimes when I hear about the tourists being robbed here, I think to myself what idiot walks back to their hotel at 10pm with a bunch of shopping bags knowing that area is a tourist trap? I know it's the BG fault, but I can't help but think that one should be responsible for taking better measures to stay away from situations like those.
 

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Dang it, you beat me to it. :2thumsup
 

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