[tenderwarrior]

If you had to defend yourself from a dog attack and had to use your weapon would/could there be any legal issues after.
This has not happened to me just seeking some info. so I can be a better informed sheepdog.
I have tried other forums on a national level but no one was real familiar with fla. law.
Hopeing to have better luck here.

 

[flccnp]

I believe there was a recent case where somebody shot two dogs attacking him. The police had no troubles with it.

There was another case in Orlando where somebody shot two other dogs claiming they were attacking some cattle. Last I heard, the police didn't arrest him.

 

[Evo1]

It's a bit of a grey area, but if the animal is an immediate threat to a person or another domestic animal, you're okay. But it has to be an immediate threat, just like with a human attacker, not just a nuisance animal.

 

[NkmG19]

There is really no law on the use of force against an animal attack. However disproportionate force is something to be mindful of. I would first try to escape any attack from an animal because it might be easier than trying to shoot a smaller than human moving target. If it's a pitbull them all that goes out the window. :ak

 

[chevthunder454]

If you had to defend yourself from a dog attack and had to use your weapon would/could there be any legal issues after.
This has not happened to me just seeking some info. so I can be a better informed sheepdog.
I have tried other forums on a national level but no one was real familiar with fla. law.
Hopeing to have better luck here.

There was an incident in Oakland Park a few weeks back where a neighbors pit bull came into a mans yard and attacked his dog. After beating it with a satellite dish and even the pit bulls owner was trying to get the dog off the mans dog, the owner of the property ran into his house to get his 45. He fired one shot and the pit bull ran home. It died later at the vets office. The police did not press any charges against the property owner, but they did give a ticket to the pit bull owner.

 

[OrlandoDriver]

I believe there was a recent case where somebody shot two dogs attacking him. The police had no troubles with it.

There was another case in Orlando where somebody shot two other dogs claiming they were attacking some cattle. Last I heard, the police didn't arrest him.

There was an update the guy that shot the dogs my find himself doin jail time they investigated further not to mention pressure from animal rights activists heard this couple weeks back if we are talking bout the incident in narcossee

 

[flccnp]

There was an update the guy that shot the dogs my find himself doin jail time they investigated further not to mention pressure from animal rights activists heard this couple weeks back if we are talking bout the incident in narcossee

Sounds about right. What are they getting him for, do you remember?

 

[deadeyedick]

Sounds about right. What are they getting him for, do you remember?

Probably for being an A-hole. :thumbsdwn

 

[brownie]

It's summer of either 1986 or 7, I'm living in a nice community just south of Boston.

Mid morning I hear this lady screaming and you just know from the tone, there's a real problem outside. I run out the front door in dungarees, no shirt, no shoes and see the older lady two doors down, same side of the street, frantic as her small dog is being attacked by a pitbull that lived across the street from her.

I'd seen the pit before in the other yard and it was a barker and always trying to get out of the fenced yard at people walking by. Probably about 60 lbs of mean attitude, and problem waiting to happen, and here that problem is presenting itself.

I run down to the ladies yard, the pit has her little "fluffy" by the ear, fluffy is whining but not much else. The pit is locked on the the dogs ear and back of the head.

I take off my belt and reach in cautiously and get the belt around the pits neck. End of the belt through the buckle and pull tight. The idea is to choke the dog out till it lets go, and not let it shake the ladies dog too much until it passes out.

I get the choke on the pit real good and tight, and the pit then realizes I'm there and turns it's attention to ME, letting fluffy go. I'm yelling to the lady to get her dog out from under and back off, call the cops while the pit is now really pi**ed and shaking as violently as it can to get lose from me

About that time, the lady that owns the pit is over and telling me to let her dog go. I'm sure I make some really bad remark to her and I'm really having all I can do to hold the pit from getting turned on one of my own arms and taking me off balance and to the ground. I've gotten more than I bargained for in this deal.

Sometime later, I'm aware of a cop telling me to let the dog go. I'm getting tired, the pit is not slowing down at all, the choke is not working, but I have the dog controlled from getting at me or others. I tell the cop to shoot the dog, I'm not letting go of the belt. He ignores my request to shoot it.

Pretty quick there are a few more cops around me, all telling me to let it go, while they are at a safer distance and have their guns drawn. I'm yelling for one of them to step up and shoot this fu**ing dog right now, when the shift sgt steps in near me. Tells me to hold on tight and keep from moving as much as possible.

Puts the gun to the pits head and fires. Dog stops struggling a little but is still alive. The lady who owned the pit is being restrained by other officers at this point, and I'm told to let go of the belt again. Pits still got some fight in him, he's staring right at me and you can just see he wants me before he goes out.

I tell the cop to shoot him again, he's still alive and I'm not letting go. Sgt gives the pit another one to the head, standing right next to me and I'm aware this time he is shielding me as much as he can with his own body, and then dog goes lifeless.

I let go of the belt and fell back on my arse. Cops help me up and want to know if I'm bit anywhere, while one officer puts the lady who owned the pit in the cruiser for making threats to them and myself for our actions. Feels like my arms at the shoulders are going to fall off, I remember I could not pick the right arm up to shake the cops hand.

I could not believe how strong that pit was. It took all of my weight and strength to keep it from twisting in the belt and getting at my arms or a leg. Later that day the lady who owned fluffy came home from the vets and walked over to my place and let me know her dog would live and thanked me for what I did to save her dog.

X-mas rolled around several months later and I came home to a package of homemade cookies she had left on my porch. She never stopped thanking me or baking me cookies for holidays as long as I lived there.
__________________________________________________________

Now that I have a horse on the property, and a big male mountain lion winter ranging every year down back in the wash, I keep a loaded 30-30 propped up in the corner at the back door. If it comes up out of the wash toward the corral for any reason, it will be taken out without question. Mountain lions are protected in Az but you can defend livestock and reports come in on the TV occasionally that one has attacked and killed some horse out here on someones property.

On another incident when I worked as an LEO in Mass., we had a call one night about shots fired. Get there to see this old timer with a rifle in his hand in the back yard. Ordered to put it down, he does and explains a bobcat was getting after his chicken coop. He missed the bobcat with several shots fired and was not charged for discharging a firearm within 500 feet of a residence per a town ordinance as he was protecting livestock.

I've been bit by a police dog while working a detail where a melee involving Cape Verdians was in progress and city and state police dogs were brought in to quell the riot and disperse the crowd. Dog came through the crowd as I was on one knee cuffing this guy and grabbed me by the right cheek where the leg starts. It was not good.

In another instance, my own shutzen trained Shep bit a guy who tried to approach me without prior recognition and acceptance. One bite caused the guy to have three operations on his arm to fix the damage. The arm got infected bad and the first operation didn't get all of the things that cause infection out, then he was in real danger of losing the arm. He didn't but it cost me a lot of money for his hospital bills and my dog got quarantined for two weeks by law.

I relate these iincidents to say this-----If I'm threatened by any dog larger than a football, it will be dispatched post haste, and I don't care what anyone thinks or says about it. I've been bitten and you can be taken down and mauled severely by a good sized dog. Don't take chances with dogs or wild animals/snakes that can inflict serious injury or death.

I would not try to run from a dog. It sets off their attack mode. Better to stand your ground and be ready to put a few into it if necessary. Dog menacing me aggressively in any way, the gun is out, I'm bladed and ready to take it out. Hope the cops get there before I have to shoot, but I'll not be cornered by a dog in any manner. I'm seriously threatened if the dog is showing aggressive action against me. It happens fast, you won't have time to get the gun out once the attack starts and can be taken off your feet and mauled or killed pretty quick.

Brownie

 

[FLRon]

I know that whenever the subject of pit bulls come up, you get some strong feelings on both sides of the coin.

My feeling is that you are going to own a dog that is supremely capable of serious injury and death, the onus is on the owner to maintain control of the animal at all times, or deal with the consequences if the dog needs to be put down because of it's aggressive act.

Public safety supersedes an individuals right to keep these dogs, IMHO.

Glad you were able to hold on. I have seen such massive and imposing looking pits that I don't think I would have gone the leather belt route Brownie!

 

[brownie]

Ron, it wasn't my intention to hurt the pit, just stop it's behavior and keep it from killing the little dog.

That happened before I got bit by a police dog myself and suffered through the results of my own dog biting another and the complications that arose afterwards from the one bite he gave this guy.

It's no longer worth the risk, the belt idea WAS a bad idea, I got lucky I could hold out long enough for the cops to end it or that dog would have been all over me and things would have gotten real ugly.

Brownie

 

[FLRon]

I guess 21 years ago you were more of an idealist in your approach.

 

[brownie]

And a lot younger with less experience in these matters

I'd still not want to hurt an animal unless necessary. The difference in 21 years is that now I know more about whats necessary:rolf

 

[deadeyedick]

I understand when it is necessary to defend yourself from a large vicious animal, but I'm curious to hear what you LE types think about this particular shooting...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lv0T2X1dXcI

and here's the story from CNN...

http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/01/09/police.kill.dog/

While I admit that the video quality is poor, it appears to me that the police not only shot the dog unnecessarily, they also precipitated the entire event by allowing the dog to escape from the vehicle even though they were asked by the family to secure it.

Brownie, I hope you're being at least somewhat facetious about shooting any dog 'larger than a football'. My 8 lb. Pomeranian is larger than a football, but he's hardly capable of inflicting "death or grievous bodily injury" on anything larger than an infant or a squirrel. While someone may escape criminal charges for shooting a dog of that size, I think they will have great difficulty convincing a jury in the ensuing civil suit (which I would most assuredly pursue, if the circumstances warranted) that they were in any danger whatsoever from such an animal, much less enough danger to warrant using deadly force.

And for the record, I have had to put down one of my own dogs in the past, so I'm not just some knee-jerk, crybaby PETA member.

 

[brownie]

Brownie, I hope you're being at least somewhat facetious about shooting any dog 'larger than a football'.

I was. What I was trying to convey was if you couldn't kick it and lift it off the ground, it's probably big enough to seriously injure you.

I understand how people are attached to their animals even if they are capable of inflicting serious injury and wouldn't be happy with your harming them even if they deserved it. There's a story here I'll relate at a different time and place about a guy that threatened to kill my Akita after it ate his Sharpei [ spl ?] to the tune of 700+ stitches. BTW- the dog lived only because it was that breed of dog.

Brownie

 

[deadeyedick]

Brownie, do know of any instances where a Taser was employed against an animal? I'm curious if it would be effective against pets or perhaps even livestock-sized animals.

 

[brownie]

I don't have any knowledge of someone using a taser on animals. I wouldn't have the first clue if it would effectively stop one but it might. Never really considered a taser for animal control until you mentioned it.

Brownie

 

[Wraith]

This isn't about dogs, but......

I went out to secure the cover over my boat before a storm rolled in last year, and I hear this hissing-chatter coming from the boat.

Sure enough, a Racoon had climbed into the boat.

He jumped out, glared at me, and I took his head off with my .45

While it was technically 'discharging a gun within City Limits', all of the officers said, "Damn good thing you had that gun with you!"

-Wraith

 

[henryher]

The incident is unfortunate but those things do happen. If a large dog exits the car the officer could take it as a sign that the family pet may want to defend its family. Like I said in a different thread, I have owned several pit bulls and other large dogs. Large dogs have the potential to cause serious harm and death. A dog bite is a very painful experience. Owners of large dogs have to have them well trained and professionally in some cases so they mind. Pit bulls are difficult to stop once they have gone into attack mode. Even the owners can be injured trying to stop that attack. Labs and Dobbermans which are the other two large dogs I am familiar with can be controlled. I would think that German Sherpherds while being very large can also be controlled. As I understand it from some breeders, Rottweillers and other large breeds that are very aggresive can be very difficult to control. One breed that is much more dangerous than any pit bull and should in my opinion be banned from being owned (I take that back, should not be bred at all) is the Fila Brasilero. Even judges at dog shows are warned not to touch them while judging or they could loose their hand. This dog is not only massive but it is intentionally bred to be vicious. They will not mind the owners if they attack and will easily kill a grown man. A woman was killed by two Filas that were owned by a neighbor in her apartment complex in NY a few yeas ago. They got loose in the hallway and attacked her in front of ther apartment as she was trying to open the door. These dogs do not attack to warn they attack to kill and will not stand down until forced to or they have killed their intended victim. Unfortunately they are gaining in popularity in the US and more of them are being sold and bred every year. They are about the size of a mastiff but attitude wise the mastiff is an infant compared to the Fila. When I owned my dogs I did everything I could to make sure they never got loose. But once in a while they did. Two of them never returned and my dobbie came home one day with a 22 cal bullet hole in her left hind quarter. Luckly it did not hit bone. While I loved my dogs, I understood that they were large and anyone facing them would feel in danger. They were lovable and I made sure that all my dogs loved people. Even my pit bulls loved to be around people and would not harm a fly. But I knew that any one that didn't know them would probably be afraid of them and I can't blame them for shooting them. They had no business running loose. My dobberman was a wonderful dog that loved every one. She was well trained and as a breeder said to me once, you can't call back a bullet but you can call back a Dobberman.

Now I have a question for all you guys out there.

I had an argument with my oldest son who tends to get an attitude now and then. He got a Rottweiller last year and was proud of his dog because no one could come near my son without the dog attacking. I warned my son that it was dangerous to have a dog that reacted that way. The first thing I told him was that a dog that attacks when he wants is not to be trusted with any one. Also that sooner or later some one is going to unexpectedly and innocently come close to him and get attacked and that would be a great liability. I also told him this: Let me know what you guys think because we are still arguing about it.

Self defense laws were written for a "person" to protect himself or someone else from death or injury. The self defense laws in Florida allows for the Castle Doctrine which gives a person a right to protect their home.

My contention is still that while the law allows for self protection, the law speaks directly to people not dogs. The right to protect ones self and home is given to people not dogs. So in my opinion, and I would like to hear your comments, if a dog attacks an intruder that is a potential threat to the owner. The dog has no right to defend. Also use of deadly force is extended to persons not animals. I think it would be a liability problem for a dog to attack a person armed or not, even in defense of himself or the owner. Let me know what you fellas think.

As a note my son no longer has the dog. He had to give him away because it attacked his daughter and also because his insurance carrier cancelled his home owner insurance when they found out he had a Rottweiller.

 

[brownie]

Dogs are a liability, as your son found out. That said,

When I had the Akita back east, anyone coming into the house after dark would be confronted by a very larger aggressive dog with an attitude if I wasn't home and my wife didn't answer the door [ which meant the dog was under control and looking for ques from either of us ].

She protected my wife, we have no kids. If I were home, I was alpha and she would let me know someone was around and work off my ques only, waiting for a sign to go or back off as "daddy" had the helm.

Anyone breaking into my house [ an illegal act ] is subject to whatever they get from me, my wife or the dog, or any combination of the three of us.

Don't want to get bit, pay attention to the barking dog BEFORE you enter without permission. Don't want to get shot, pay attention to me or my wife. It's pretty simple terms. A barking dog is a deterrent and warning to people to not enter without the possibility of dealing with a row of teeth that will not be the most pleasant experience. If the barking dog has not deterred the intruder, he's showing his bad intentions and lack of care for his own safety. He gets what he gets-----it's war----and like the saying goes,

All's fair in love and war right?

Brownie