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I asked about the armed response team at Ashley Furniture on ISB. The manager looked at me confused. I said, "The sign on the door says for everyone's safety people can't carry firearms in the store. That obviously means you have an armed response team, just like law enforcement arrives armed, because otherwise how could it be for our safety when criminals don't obey rules or laws?"

He informed me that even he has to keep his firearm in the car. My response? "Wait, you mean you guys aren't armed and you're also asking the customers to disarm? Holy crap, do you realize the liability you've opened yourself up to should something happen by stating we are safer by leaving our means of protection outside?"

I could see the mouse hop on the wheel. It was then that I stated, "I'm sorry, my wife and I do not feel safe or comfortable here. And if Ashley Furniture is willing to lie to us over this, about our very own safety and protection, we don't feel that we can trust anything within this establishment. Thank you for your time." And we left.

Did it do any good? Well, it made me feel better and it made my wife laugh, so yeah, it did! :grin

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So, upon seeing the sign, did you disarm before entering the premises? Did you abide by the sign before you went in to have a conversation with the manager?
 

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I asked about the armed response team at Ashley Furniture on ISB. The manager looked at me confused. I said, "The sign on the door says for everyone's safety people can't carry firearms in the store. That obviously means you have an armed response team, just like law enforcement arrives armed, because otherwise how could it be for our safety when criminals don't obey rules or laws?"

He informed me that even he has to keep his firearm in the car. My response? "Wait, you mean you guys aren't armed and you're also asking the customers to disarm? Holy crap, do you realize the liability you've opened yourself up to should something happen by stating we are safer by leaving our means of protection outside?"

I could see the mouse hop on the wheel. It was then that I stated, "I'm sorry, my wife and I do not feel safe or comfortable here. And if Ashley Furniture is willing to lie to us over this, about our very own safety and protection, we don't feel that we can trust anything within this establishment. Thank you for your time." And we left.

Did it do any good? Well, it made me feel better and it made my wife laugh, so yeah, it did! :grin

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Nice!
It would have been nice to see the interaction and the look on the manager’s face.
 

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Discussion Starter #23
Thanks, I know these signs have no foundation in law - was just curious how prevalent they might be. I just expected to see one at an Apple or other "left wing yuppie" type establishment like say Starbucks. I would periodically even see them in NJ where there are only about 1,500 carry permits for non-LEOs in a state of about 9 million people.
 

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So, upon seeing the sign, did you disarm before entering the premises? Did you abide by the sign before you went in to have a conversation with the manager?
I can't remember. You know what they say is the first to go! It's the . . . ummm . . . crap. :grin

@Bonz--You would have loved it, sir! :laughing

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You could probably change that to how many people (with a CWFL) have been "discovered" anywhere much less with a posted sign? Never in 23 years for me.
I've only been discovered once, and then it wasn't by an employee. I was pocket carrying a Ruger LCP in a DeSantis pocket holster. I was in a movie theater climbing the stairs to my seat and a guy in an aisle seat saw the outline of the pistol as I bent my leg to ascend from one stair tread to the next and my pant leg stretched tight across the pistol. He made a remark about me wanting to feel real safe during the movie and I said "You got that right buddy " and kept moving. He looked ex military and must have been cool with it because he didn't report me.
 

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Know this part of FL statutes 790.06 and don't even pay attention to any other sign. Just memorize these places and go about your business.

(12)(a) A license issued under this section does not authorize any person to openly carry a handgun or carry a concealed weapon or firearm into:
1. Any place of nuisance as defined in s. 823.05;
2. Any police, sheriff, or highway patrol station;
3. Any detention facility, prison, or jail;
4. Any courthouse;
5. Any courtroom, except that nothing in this section would preclude a judge from carrying a concealed weapon or determining who will carry a concealed weapon in his or her courtroom;
6. Any polling place;
7. Any meeting of the governing body of a county, public school district, municipality, or special district;
8. Any meeting of the Legislature or a committee thereof;
9. Any school, college, or professional athletic event not related to firearms;
10. Any elementary or secondary school facility or administration building;
11. Any career center;
12. Any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on the premises, which portion of the establishment is primarily devoted to such purpose;
13. Any college or university facility unless the licensee is a registered student, employee, or faculty member of such college or university and the weapon is a stun gun or nonlethal electric weapon or device designed solely for defensive purposes and the weapon does not fire a dart or projectile;
14. The inside of the passenger terminal and sterile area of any airport, provided that no person shall be prohibited from carrying any legal firearm into the terminal, which firearm is encased for shipment for purposes of checking such firearm as baggage to be lawfully transported on any aircraft; or
15. Any place where the carrying of firearms is prohibited by federal law.
(b) A person licensed under this section shall not be prohibited from carrying or storing a firearm in a vehicle for lawful purposes.
(c) This section does not modify the terms or conditions of s. 790.251(7).
(d) Any person who knowingly and willfully violates any provision of this subsection commits a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.
 

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Know this part of FL statutes 790.06 and don't even pay attention to any other sign. Just memorize these places and go about your business.
There are a handful of others in addition to the 790.06(12)(a) list:

790.115 - weapons prohibited at school-sponsored events and on school property (which is a little broader than 790.06(12)(a)(10) and (13) - and is a felony).

394.458 - no firearms in or upon the grounds of hospitals providing mental health services under Part 1 of the Florida Mental Health Act.

258.157 - no firearms in the Savannas State Reserve (with exceptions).

311.12(3) - no possessing firearms in secure and restricted areas of certain seaports - seaport must provide clear notice of the prohibition.
 

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There are a handful of others in addition to the 790.06(12)(a) list:

790.115 - weapons prohibited at school-sponsored events and on school property (which is a little broader than 790.06(12)(a)(10) and (13) - and is a felony).

394.458 - no firearms in or upon the grounds of hospitals providing mental health services under Part 1 of the Florida Mental Health Act.

258.157 - no firearms in the Savannas State Reserve (with exceptions).

311.12(3) - no possessing firearms in secure and restricted areas of certain seaports - seaport must provide clear notice of the prohibition.
Brian, why not Savannah State Reserve, when you can carry in most other parks?
 

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Brian, why not Savannah State Reserve, when you can carry in most other parks?
The $64,000 question. Somehow it got written in as an exception years ago, and the legislature has never bothered to change things. At this point I'm not even sure that God Almighty actually knows why that one park is different.
 

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The $64,000 question. Somehow it got written in as an exception years ago, and the legislature has never bothered to change things. At this point I'm not even sure that God Almighty actually knows why that one park is different.
Last time we discussed it we came to the same conclusion...

https://www.floridaconcealedcarry.com/Forum/showthread.php?42256-Savannas-Preserve-State-Park

Here is the actual statute if anyone wants to see it:

258.156 Savannas State Reserve.—As used in this act
(1) “Savannas” means the Savannas State Reserve located in St. Lucie and Martin Counties, generally described as lying within sections 1, 2, 11, 12, 13, 14, and 24, Township 36 South, Range 40 East, sections 7, 18, 19, 29, 30, 31, and 32, Township 36 South, Range 41 East, sections 4, 5, 8, 9, 16, and 21, Township 37 South, Range 41 East, and as more particularly described in the official records of Martin and St. Lucie Counties.
(2) “Vehicle” means a motorized device, such as a motor vehicle or a piece of mechanized equipment, for the transporting of passengers, goods, or apparatus.
(3) “Firearm” means a weapon capable of firing a missile, including a pistol, rifle, or shotgun using an explosive charge as a propellant; a spearfish gun; a crossbow; or a bow and arrow.
(4) “A.T.V.” means an all-terrain vehicle, a motorized vehicle which may be used on or off a road, may traverse forest or wetlands, and may have two or more wheels. For purposes of this act, a motorcycle is considered to be an A.T.V.

History.
—s. 1, ch. 90-258.

258.157 Prohibited acts in Savannas State Reserve.—
(1) It is unlawful for any person, except an on-duty law enforcement or conservation officer, to operate a vehicle or A.T.V. in the Savannas unless such person is using the provided ingress or egress to a private holding within the described boundary or using the vehicle or A.T.V. to transport a boat to a public boat ramp accessible only through state reserve property, or unless the vehicle or A.T.V. is being used in conjunction with a permitted or supervised educational field trip, a wildlife survey, or state agency natural resources management activities.
(2) It is unlawful for any person, except a law enforcement or conservation officer, to have in his or her possession any firearm while within the Savannas except when in compliance with regulations established by the Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission applying to lands within the described boundaries.
(3) Any person who violates this section commits a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.

History.
—s. 3, ch. 90-258; s. 154, ch. 95-148; s. 77, ch. 99-245.


And finally a link to the entire Chapter. You can see how complex it is:

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0200-0299/0258/0258.html
 

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Brian, why not Savannah State Reserve, when you can carry in most other parks?
I have no idea. As others mentioned it has its very own special law protecting specifically that reserve. Guess that means I'll never go there.
 

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(3) Any person who violates this section commits a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.
At least violation is only a misdemeanor!

Of course, it's not even that (not illegal at all) if someone carries there accidentally and didn't know of the prohibition.


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At least violation is only a misdemeanor!

Of course, it's not even that (not illegal at all) if someone carries there accidentally and didn't know of the prohibition.


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I'm not sure that is correct. As to the prohibited places enumerated in 790.06, there is the affirmative defense of 15. (d):

(d) Any person who knowingly and willfully violates any provision of this subsection commits a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.

But I don't think mens rea is an element of a violation of 258.157(2).

Anyone feel free to correct me if i'm wrong. I'm doing this one off the top of my head.
 

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I'm not sure that is correct. As to the prohibited places enumerated in 790.06, there is the affirmative defense of 15. (d):

(d) Any person who knowingly and willfully violates any provision of this subsection commits a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.

But I don't think mens rea is an element of a violation of 258.157(2).

Anyone feel free to correct me if i'm wrong. I'm doing this one off the top of my head.
Interesting point.

Black powder may be the only legal way to have a gun.

I do appreciate your knowledge, TII!

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Interesting point.

Black powder may be the only legal way to have a gun.

I do appreciate your knowledge, TII!

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Firearms are not mentioned in their literature.

If for some reason I really wanted to go there and really wanted to carry, I would play dumb and give them a call and ask what the policy is for CC firearms.

I would not OC there since there is still a statute in place and I would not want to call attention to myself.

It all depend on how much you want to visit and how much you want to carry.

The statute (258.157) appears to ban even the storage of a firearm in your vehicle per 790.25 and/or 790.06 (12)(b). I don't go anywhere that requires me to disarm during my commute to and from. That's just me.
 

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Interesting point.

Black powder may be the only legal way to have a gun.
Some day when I'm retired and don't have to worry about losing my job for getting arrested on stupid crap I will probably do things like this. Just go strolling around with my purty stainless 1858 strapped to my hip and wait for the opportunity to educate someone about it not being a firearm.

Stainless1858.jpg
 

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Some day when I'm retired and don't have to worry about losing my job for getting arrested on stupid crap I will probably do things like this. Just go strolling around with my purty stainless 1858 strapped to my hip and wait for the opportunity to educate someone about it not being a firearm.

View attachment 60571
That looks nice! Which one is it?

This is my NAA Earl:



It seems I don't have a photo of my Mini BP.

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Some day when I'm retired and don't have to worry about losing my job for getting arrested on stupid crap I will probably do things like this. Just go strolling around with my purty stainless 1858 strapped to my hip and wait for the opportunity to educate someone about it not being a firearm.

I love the look of stainless and its ease of maintenance, but I also like the traditional look of brass combined with case hardened steel. I will carry my 1851 Confederate

Navy Sheriff when the time comes.

 
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