[Uechi]

I got pulled over yesterday for supposedly driving through a road that was posted. I honestly did not see any sign. I received a citation for " Violation of a Traffic Control Device " A catch all phrase used to cover a variety of offenses. In any event, I can suck it up and pay the fine and go through the Driver Improvement Course to prevent getting points. What I can't abide is the absolute nasty mean spirited attitude adopted by the LEO Sgt that pulled me over. From the moment he came up to the window I new I was going to catch it. He rudely asked for my license and registration. If I had been carrying a firearm I could have given him my CWL or kept quiet. Since he didn't ask and I'm not required to tell him I said nothing about the automatic knife I had in my pocket.

I asked him why I had had been stopped and he lambasted me about using the road as a highway ( I was driving 15-20mph ) I stated that I didn't know it was posted. He gave me lecture then returned to his unmarked car. Upon his return he gave me a cltation whereupon I said " You have to be kidding me". He told me to shut up and I said I thought you would cut me a break since it was an inadvertent mistake. He again told me to shut up and I said why. He then said he wasn't paid to put up with this and if I didn't keep quiet he'd arrest me for disorderly conduct. Under no circumstances did I yell at or curse at or disrespect the officer in anyway, unless talking is a crime.

I am very happy that I wasn't carrying at the time because if I had handed him my CWL or if he had asked if I had a gun I'd of been in trouble. The way this guy was acting there is absolutely no doubt in my mind that I would have been spread eagle on the ground and handcuffed for no reason.

The first thing I did when I got home was contact the Clearwater Police Department and file a complaint. Within five minutes of my e-mail I received
a telephone call from a LEO asking me for the specifics. I gave him the officers badge number. I could not provide a name because his signature was illegible. In any event, the Police representative was extremely apologetic. I let him know that I have nothing but respect for the Clearwater Police but that the officer in question either needed to get an attitude adjsutment or find a new line of work. I understand that the LEO may have had a particulary bad day however I didn't need to be talked to like I was some kind of animal. The point of this rant is that sometimes fate steps in. If I had been carrying I'm sure I would have gotten a lot more abuse from this officer

 

[FLRon]

It stinks getting a ticket, but it happens. The "you gotta be kidding me" doesn't engender much sympathy, as he obviously wasn't kidding, or you wouldn't be sitting on the side of the road receiving a ticket.

Similarly "cutting you a break" is his prerogative, and not usually effective when it is suggested by the driver who is receiving the ticket.

Don't let it ruin your day.

 

[Uechi]

What's ruining my day is being talk to like an insect. My comments might not have engendered sympathy but he was nasty before I even opened my mouth and when I did my comments were based on being incredulous that he was actually going to give me a ticket. I draw the line when I was threatened with being arrested for talking, talking not screaming. I don't expect to get an apology from him, but I do expect to get one from the department. Thanks for your inputs FL Ron. Have a good day.

 

[MamaBear]

It's when you don't report things like this that they continue to get away with it. It all boils down to the character of the person taking your phone call. They could have been all sympathetic on the phone, but you never know what they do when you hang up. They could actually follow procedure or totally disregard the conversation and call you a whiner.

We can't do anything when something is out of our hands. If you don't mind, I would like to share a story that happened to me yesterday regarding being unfairly judged as well. I was sitting at a red light with one car and one truck ahead of me. We were turning left. All of the traffic was moving through the light when all of a sudden I look to my right and see the oncoming straight lane right upon me honking their horns. I couldn't figure out what was going on but was instantly terrified that I was in the middle of the intersection with everyone pressing in on me. The woman passenger had rage in her face and was shaking her hands and yelling, I presume she was cussing at me and calling me every name in the book. The end of the truck was still moving through the intersection so I had to jut over to the other left turn lane just to get out of the intersection myself. I was horrified that as I was in the middle of the intersection the light changed and I couldn't see it because of the truck. It gave the appearance I was trying to run the light. These cars were within feet of me and let me have it with every verbal and physical demonstration they could muster. To say I was trembling is an understatement.

We live in a society with little or no mercy or understanding and certainly no patience. Many, many things we must let slide because we are helpless to change any one's character. In a selfish society we end up victims over innocent errors. Like you, I could only imagine what would have happened if they intentionally hit me to force a law suit. Who knows what would have happened if that woman came at me physically with the rage she had already demonstrated. I was carrying at the time and shudder to think what charges would have been brought against me if I needed to defend myself. By all appearances I was in the middle of the intersection and would have been slaughtered on the altar of justice had a wreck ensued. I hate driving.

Sorry I hijacked your story, but this is very fresh in my mind.

 

[capngeo]

In a large PD like Clearwater, one would think a "hot head" would be weeded out before they became a SGT. Unfortunately, some go into LE because they were the kid who got his arse kicked everyday in school, and want to give back to the world.

I had a similar incident with a Florida Marine Patrol officer 20 years ago when I was running tug & barge. He was a 20 year guy with a bad reputation for hiding his cowardice behind his badge. By the time I got done writing letters (they carry MUCH more weight than a call or email, AND go into their employee file), He was removed from the water, posted to a desk job, and "retired" 2 months later. The company I worked for had a continuous video loop in the pilot house of every tug.... His threats and tirade were caught in living color.

and to MamaBear....... If YOU were occupying the intersection prior to the red light change>>>> YOU had the right-of-way<<<<

 

[deadeyedick]

Unfortunately, the law enforcement profession is infested with bullies. All you can do is call them out on their behavior using the proper civilian complaint procedures.

And Mamabear, I find that giving the finger to other obnoxious motorists to be quite theraputic.

 

[Uechi]

Good responses from everyone. I'm 63 years old and never had an occasion to file a complaint about an officer. We''ll see what develops from the e-mail and my phone conversation. I have no problem writing a letter to the Chief if it is required. I'm not out for revenge against this LEO just a recognition that I was treated badly before and after the ticket was issued.
I'm glad MamaBear that you weren't hurt. Sounds like you didn't do a thing to get such nasty behaviour. I have had occasions where I was pretty well scoured by sick patients and upset relatives, but as an EMT that is to be expected. If I had acted like the LEO I would have been reprimanded and if it happened again I'd have been looking for a new job.

 

[Uechi]

Bullies I have always been able to handle. A punch in the nose or a threat to do so usually solved the problem. Try that with a deserving LEO amd you get to go to jail. My experiences with the police have until date always been very positive. Unfortunately COPs are like anybody else there are good ones and bad ones.

 

[Red Dawg]

Unfortunately, the law enforcement profession is infested with bullies. All you can do is call them out on their behavior using the proper civilian complaint procedures.

And Mamabear, I find that giving the finger to other obnoxious motorists to be quite theraputic.

+1 on the "you're number one" jesture deadeye. It does wonders especially when you get cut off, you flip them off, they gawg in awe, and "run" from you as you drive right behind them.

 

[Mhilsee]

I am in know way a LEO, I had 1 prob. Like yours , I was in a car , the few times I have been pulled over I have been on my bike and it seems they just want to talk bikes, then when they find I carry the talk changes to guns
Knock on wood but seems LEO in Lee County are still some good old boys istols

 

[357 9mm]

A few years ago, I was driving my wife and mother-in-law to the funeral of my father-in-law. An unmarked car pulled even with mine on the highway and then dropped back behind me. He turned on his flashers and pulled me over. I had not been speeding, but was not wearing a seat belt. At that time, LEO was not permitted to stop anyone for not wearing a seat belt only. He was very rude to me and issued me a ticket. I wrote a letter to his Commander, and received a nice letter back saying that the LEO was given a reprimand and an unpaid day off. I still had to pay the fine.

 

[Mac45]

I am hesitant to get involved in this, but I will anyway.

First of all, it sounds as if the sergeant may have behaved in an unprofessional manner. You were correct to bring this to the attention of his department for two reasons. First, there may be a situation in his private life that is causing him excessive stress. If identified early, the department can take steps to help him correct the situation before he causes larger problems for the public, the department and himself. As he is a sergeant for a relatively large department, it is doubtful that this is his normal demeanor; but not impossible. If this is his normal way of performing his job, then it is something that the department will definitely want to be made aware of. No LEO likes to get complaints, but it comes with the territory. In many cases, the complaint turns out to be frivolous [ a ticketed motorist complaining after receiving a citation, for example]. But, sometimes they are justified and if a LEO is receiving an inordinant amount of complaints for similar behavior, the department will look into it.

Not being a witness to the incident, I cannot comment upon what transpired. I will say that often the less said to the officer the better. If you have an explanation make it and sit back and let the officer do his job. Once the officer has decided to write the citation, it is unlikely that you will persuade him to forego it. You will have the opportunity to contest the citaiton in court and that is the time to bring any evidence [such as missing or obscured signage, etc.] to the magistrate's attention.

Oh, by the way. I know that nearly everyone in the country moves into the intersection to wait to make a left turn [driver's ed classes even teach people to do it], but it is, in fact, a violation of Florida state statute.

F.S.S. 316.2061 Stop when traffic obstructed.--No driver shall enter an intersection or a marked crosswalk unless there is sufficient space on the other side of the intersection or crosswalk to accommodate the vehicle the driver is operating without obstructing the passage of other vehicles or pedestrians, notwithstanding any traffic control signal indication to proceed. A violation of this section is a noncriminal traffic infraction, punishable as a moving violation as provided in chapter 318.

Be careful. It's a jungle out there.

 

[FLRon]

Uechi, from your initial post, i had the impression that perhaps you were a young driver surprised by being pulled over, and perhaps came across with some youthful swagger.

After reading your subsequent posts I see that you are a bit older and I would assume you know how to handle yourself.

I think you were correct in making a civilian complaint in writing. In a case such as this, the ticket is almost secondary. If this officer has a pattern of abusive behavior, it should be documented and brought to the attention of his superiors.

Stay safe.

 

[T.S.]

Uechi,

While it is still fresh in your mind, you may want to take the time to write everything exactly the way it happened into a letter and mail it directly to:

Sid Klein
Chief of Police
Clearwater Police Department
645 Pierce St.
Clearwater, FL 33756

Include information such as:

Day, date, time of day, location, your action, the officers action, your later call to the department, etc.

Also, you may want to indicate that you are doing so as an FYI to the Chief for his benefit and that of his department, so if this officer IS a problem the Chief can handle it BEFORE it turns into a major problem.

 

[trulies]

It's usually 50/50 for me.

Some LEOs are just gruff because they are in defense mode. Good guys with good judgment in the end.

Some are utmost professionals and leave you with a smile even though you owe $250.

A few are complete turds whom have to be followed up on. Had one outright lie to me about why I was pulled over. Long story, but let's say my tail light was just fine, and his New York attitude didn't get him vary far.

 

[fuzzy03cls]

Hey it happens.
You filed the complaint, move on.
I would not pay a fine though. Get a court date & then plead no contest to the judge at the hearing. Almost all traffic court judges will not give points if your record is clean. I plead any ticket like this. I have never had 1 go against me.


Why weren't you carrying?

 

[MPDC66]

You will probably find that other Police officers actually hate to hear this happened. Most are fair and polite and make that a personal policy even when the person they have stopped is truly obnoxious. All a rude officer does is perpetuate a stereotype.

Sometimes I think it would be good training for officers from other jurisdictions to work in Washington, DC for a day. Stopping a Diplomat, especially from France or the Middle East, can be an exercise in trying one's patience. Unless they make the mistake of laying a hand on you, you are stuck with putting up with their arrogance and a smile and "Your Country must truly be proud of the way you represent them." is the only retort. I have actually written a French Diplomat a ticket, watched him laugh and tear it up in front of me and calmly repeated with a ticket for littering. Seems a high volume of tickets may (or may not) be used against him by his own authorities IF they feel embarrassed by the over the top behavior. Have done that a few times and , one time, a Middle Eastern gentleman, claiming to be a Diplomat and quickly flashing an "I.D", tore up the littering ticket and actually threw it in my face. I lost my temper, took him to the pavement and discovered he was NOT a Diplomat but merely had "Press Credentials" from some Egyptian rag. Of course , I charged him with APO , knowing that while the Prosecutor would reduce it to simple assault or disorderly conduct, it would at least buy him a weekend in jail. Moral, don't display contempt of cop on a Friday night!

 

[ZO6Vettever]

I've not been stopped too many times after the teen years. Most have been OK and a couple were horrible. A bad day is probably the problem with the LEO. You got no choice but to suck it up, their word is often considered gospel.

 

[Uechi]

Thanks for all the feedback its appreciated. It's amazing how many level headed intelligent people there are out there and forum members are at the top. I am definitely going to write a respectful letter and send it to the Chief. I don't think I deserved a ticket but I would never file a complaint about an officer for such a frivolous reason. I accept the fact that I made a mistake and have to pay the consequences, which is something a lot of people don't like to do these days. What I will not accept is being treated like some kind of bum. I have no desire to hurt the LEO's record but that just isn't the way to act. I do understand we are all human beings and make mistakes. Thanks again guys and gals for the support and for your opinions. Regards.

 

[PM667]

I am curious, did you miss the sign or was it missing or obstructed? If you decide on court this could help you, good luck !

Paul