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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Anybody use a Crimson Trace or Lazermax on their rigs? Would you recommend either, both, or none? Why?
 

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I guess I'm kinda old school...I recently shot a friends Walther G22 with the laser...and (still) found myself preferring the open sights. (better accuracy)

Though they DO make great entertainment if you have a kitty cat... ;)

I can see where they would be handy at night...or over longer distances than you may typically shoot with a handgun...but so far...I'm not big on them on pistols.
 

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When my wife first began to shoot, I bought her a Taurus .22 with a Crimson Trace on it to help her with her shooting.

She relied on it at first, but now she is shooting well enough with the .38, .357 Mag. and the .45 acp. that she no longer uses the laser.

She now uses her .22 loaded with shot-shell when she is out gardening. She hates snakes, and all she needs to do is put the red-dot near the snake, pull the trigger, and let the shot-shell do the rest. :D
 

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I currently use a Lasermax Internal laser in my Glock 36 and it great.
Pros:

The laser in internal in the Glock so no need to replace your current holsters
Installation was very easy and straight forward
Laser is always available inside the gun, so there is no need to remove it of put it back on.
So far the laser has worked 100% of the time with no problems at all.

Cons:
The Lasermax is kind of expensive, I think it lists for about $340, but you can find it cheaper of you do a search online. I purchased mine for about $270 and then used an NRA rebate for $25 or $50 so you can find it cheaper.
The front of the laser gets very dirty after a couple of rounds and you need to clean the front of it.

The laser sometimes turns on after you take a shoot or two


On a side note, never rely on the laser, because when you need it, it may not work. I usually go to the range and leave the laser off. After I’m done with 90% of my practice, I switch to the laser on and do target practice.
 

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I have a crimson trace on one of my carry guns - a glock 27... I like it.. does not get dirty.. is pretty accurate though it varries at different ranges .. would scare the s*** out of anyone who sees the light on em.. and I could shoot around corners with it if I needed to... same gun has night sights and I rigged like this so that it would be as functional as possible. I do not rely on the laser...
 

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the crimson trace dvd they have as a free offer on their site has some training on how the laser can be used as a training tool for identifying errors in muzzle control. and using it for quick shots when standard aiming down the sights isnt available.
 

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Erodg23,

Thanks for the info about the free DVD offer :thumsup , I just ordered it from their website.
I’m not knocking Crimson trace, but one issue I had with their laser was my trigger finger was always in the way of the laser if it was not on the trigger. I would suggest if you are planning on purchasing the Crimson Trace for your gun, you test it out in a store first.

Rado
 

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ahaha i would never play that much for a laser ill just get a houge grip and rubberband a dollar store lazer on it :rolf
 

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Red Dawg,
Not sure if you are still looking for a laser, but I just purchased a Lasermax from www.lasersales.com ( I am not in any way affiliated with them) paid $272.95 for the LMS-1131P (Glock 19) with free shipping. I was looking around the web for a good price and that’s the best I found. They range from $499, yes someone was selling for that much to the lowest at laser sales. I purchased my other Lasermax for the Glock 36 from them and had no issues.

Rado
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Red Dawg,
Not sure if you are still looking for a laser, but I just purchased a Lasermax from www.lasersales.com ( I am not in any way affiliated with them) paid $272.95 for the LMS-1131P (Glock 19) with free shipping. I was looking around the web for a good price and that’s the best I found. They range from $499, yes someone was selling for that much to the lowest at laser sales. I purchased my other Lasermax for the Glock 36 from them and had no issues.

Rado
Thanks. I'll check into it.
 

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For these eyes that are already having trouble focussing on one plane, the laser sight is a blessing. I don't have to be concerned about front, sight, rear sight, target - all at different distances. All I do is place the red dot on the target area and I am done. The gun does the rest. And it is extremely accurate!! The lead goes in the red! In low light, or in the dark you cannot ask for anything better.

This does not distract from actually being proficient using iron sights either. When I go to the range, I usually start out with the iron sights, totally embarras myself, then turn on the laser and regain some self image. But I enjoy shooting with both laser and iron sights.

I have a Crimson Trace Lasergrip on my Beretta 92FS and very happy with it.

I also have a Lasermax LMS-UNI rail mount laser currently sitting in my safe. I will mount it either on the PX4 or on the FN5.7

Of the two lasers, my personal preference is the intergrated CTC Lasergrips. Nothing hanging off the end of the gun and then not being able to find a holster to carry it in. CTC also has THE MOST AWESOME Customer Support!!!
 

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While you're looking at laser manufacturers it may be worth your time to investigate Armalaser.com. (MSRP $169.00).

I share many of the thoughts and concerns of many of the members who have posted regarding the need to be proficient with the open iron sights.

Murphy's law dictates that what can go wrong usually will. Thus, your laser will have an obstruction (Lint?) when you need it most.

If you accept that risk and take the right precautions you can reduce the risks of such failures.Inspect your gun and test the laser before you go out, use a holster that keeps most things away from the lens, etc... Taking these steps could keep your rig going without a hitch.

Back to the product;

Armalaser's seling point is their "Instant on" feature, which takes some of work out of the equation. The idea is IMHO a good one, in that the contact is made by the trigger finger of the shooter as he is places the finger in the trigger guard to fire. Thus, there is no need to consciously think to engage a switch (Lasermax) and or squeeze the pressure switch properly (Crimson Trace).

The biggest downside to the set up is the laser housing itself. By design it sits forward of the gun and ads bulk, thus will requiring a special holster for carry. (It makes the gun look pretty futuristic though ;).

Armalaser does sell several reputable brands of holster on their site (DeSantis, Don Hume) but, if you don't like the styles they offer, then you will have to go custom or perhaps utilize some type of clip draw set up.

I have used an Armalaser on my P-32 for about a year and have been reasonably happy. MAKE SURE TO CHECK YOUR BATTERIES however, as low battery life will result in sporadic functioning.

When you have charged batteries, the thing works intuitively and I feel that it suits my needs.

I respect Crimson Trace, but it will add some heft to the grip (usually) and on Glocks, it can be a comfort issue (Given the Glock's already squared frame).

Laser Max is IMHO downright cool, but it requires the user to engage the switch in the least intuitive manner (IMHO). Put another way, when the adrenaline is pumping and all you want to do is shoot, fumbling for a switch is going to be more difficult. (This has happened to me in the relatively tame mil sim combat environment, so I can only imagine what happens when lives are at stake).

For me, the best laser sight is the one you don't have to think too hard to use.

Another point I like to make about lasers is the non-lethal deterrence factor. I preface this by restating what so many have said (And what the case law says from what I have seen). Don't pull the gun unless you're prepared to shoot the gun and kill the target.

BUT! I have heard of plenty of stories (Hearsay, I know) where good guys are forced to pull guns on bad guys and the bad guys scatter at the sight of the weapon.

For me, I would be happy if I die without having ever shot or killed anyone. Thus, if I ever get into a situation where I need to draw, I will (I pray) be prepared to kill.

However, if the laser is enough to scare the would be attacker away (Say on an evening stroll with my Wife) I will be perfectly fine with it. Thus, in my eyes, the laser provides a less lethal mode of deterrence.

On the flip side, there is the logic that most shootings occur within relatively close quarters (7' or less I believe). And so lasers, night sights, fiber optics etc... become irrelevant as you aren't really aiming, its more of a general pointing.
So do you avoid the new technology that is mini laser sights or embrace it? I have chosen to embrace it.

I entered the world of firearms with the notion that the oldest tech was the best proven tech. Thus, my first gun was a PPK/s clone. Then I went to a steel snubby then a Beretta M92 and then a steel 1911. I hated the feel of the plastic bodied offerings and I derided the Glocks and Sigmas and XD's as tupperware fads. What changed was when I realized that the 1911s are heavy sons of guns. And the .38 snubby had a footprint that was roughly the size of the baby glock. In addition, the felt recoil on the G26 felt like butter compared with the jarring slam of the snubby.

It occurred to me that the new polymer material may not feel or look as good as blued or nickel plated steel. But it was an advance in technology. Just as we progressed from muskets to breach loaders and on to SA revolvers, so too have we progressed from the heady world of metal only frames.(At least thats the conclusion I came to).

For all my rhetoric against the tupperware crowd, in the end I chose to stake my life on a Glock and a Kel Tec. Both of which are firmly in the plastic framed market.

The point is that technology is not always good, but its not always bad either.

For me the laser and the tupperware are the ticket.

Thats a bit more than .02USD but there it is ;)

Konrad
 

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laser sights

Great post Konrad. Received my Armalaser for my P32 last week and am itching to try it out at the range. :D One of these afternoons it might not rain!

Safe and sane shooting everyone,

johnstuf
 

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I'm holding out for a laser that's as destructive as the bullets. :D
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I think I want one. Don't quite know what I'd do with it yet or where I'd hide it from my wife. My gun cabinet is not big enough.
 
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