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Psychologist Discusses Citizens Shooting Criminals
Doctor Says Citizen Shooters Need Counseling

POSTED: 7:54 pm EST January 10, 2009
UPDATED: 8:37 pm EST January 10, 2009

http://www.wesh.com/news/18454944/detail.html

ORLANDO, Fla. -- Friday night, a man was washing his car and he said two men, one with a sawed-off shotgun, tried to rob him.

He had a gun and shot one of the robbers.

On Saturday, a forensic psychologist discussed the toll it takes on citizens who shoot criminals. She said it can be very traumatic.

Friday's shooting was the second time in a week where a citizen shot and killed a criminal. Earlier in the week, surveillance video showed a customer shooting 40-year-old Freddie Carson as he was attacking a clerk at a convenience store in Ocoee.

"Even if they are the good guys, it is a very traumatic situation," said forensic psychologist Dr. Deborah Day.

Day said citizen shooters need counseling.

"Most people have nightmares, flashbacks and need intervention to cope with what they have done," Day said.

Chris, the man who shot the first robber, said he has been having nightmares about what happened Monday night.

Day said the best thing for him to do is talk about it.

"Without it, that permanency takes over and leaves a permanent injury that will not go away," Day said.

Chris said he apologized to the family about what happened.

Ocoee police said his actions are still under investigation.

Orange County deputies said that what happened at the car wash on Friday was self-defense.
 

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Psychologist Discusses Citizens Shooting Criminals
Doctor Says Citizen Shooters Need Counseling

Chris, the man who shot the first robber, said he has been having nightmares about what happened Monday night.

Day said the best thing for him to do is talk about it.
Unfortunately, talking about it can cause legal issues for him. Comments in the thread about the shooting pretty much agree that the talking that he's already done was not in his best interest. Go figure.
 

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Sound like a shrink who's trying to drum up business for himself. The notion that the righteous taking of another's life is an automatic cause for PTSD is absurd. There's nothing wrong with somebody who doesn't feel bad about killing a BG.
 

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The doctor is a woman, if I read it correctly.

I think you're being a bit hard on her. I suspect many people who go through something like this do need a bit of counseling. If not professional, then at least someone who listens. I think some police departments require it.
 

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The doctor is a woman, if I read it correctly.

I think you're being a bit hard on her.
That's because I'm a cynical, emotionless cyborg. :D

I suspect many people who go through something like this do need a bit of counseling. If not professional, then at least someone who listens. I think some police departments require it.
I completely agree that if somebody wants to speak with counselor after a shooting they should do so. What I reject is the idea that anytime somebody shoots a bad guy that they must have counseling or there's something wrong with them. Just because an LEA mandates counseling for its officers after a shooting doesn't mean that the officer necessarily needs it. Some people can cap an evil predator and not lose a wink's sleep over it.
 

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I agree with you, but all the doctor said was that most people need help coping with it.
 

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If I come to my kids defense from some dirtbag I'll sleep good at night when I tuck them in safely in their own beds. If it's some BG on the street trying to stick me up for a meal and he forces me to shoot him as a last resort it will bother me. I would have to say a prayer for him and myself.
 

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I think this ties into the way sheepdog are treated by much of society.

We've all read the article regarding the differences between sheepdogs, sheep and wolves showing how the sheep fear the sheepdog and ostracize the sheepdog till the wolves start circling. When a sheepdog uses their bite, a fear of being ostracized must often happen.

Society has told us that taking anybody's life is bad. The sheepdog has taken a life. The sheepdog is bad. That has to be rough on somebody whose psyche demands that they do what they must to be accepted. They need somebody who is seen as trusted to tell them what they did was right. That is where a shrink can come into play.

Of course if society stopped with the "violence never settles anything" BS and the demands that the sheepdog be sheep, the sheepdogs who do the right thing would probably never need a shrink.
 

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weather its my kids wife or my defence i will sleep when night come especialy if its a known BG..but when the police comes to investigate i will ask to go to a hospital and talk to a doctor (NOT A SHRINK DONT WANT THAT ON MY RECORD)there under there care to get it out of my system then go home and hug my family
 

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Would talking about it with a shrink cause legal problems? It wouldn't have been a felony or any other crime, and there's all that client/patient confidentiality business.

-JT
 

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I think Clint Eastwood said it best in the movie "Gran Torino"..."It's not what a man is ordered to do that is hard to live with, It's what he did that he wasn't ordered to do"...I spent a couple of years with a shrink getting adjusted mentally after a few years in a little South East Asian country. The gist of what came out of that was I had turned into a Predator, I was the Wolf. I was the hunter not the hunted. It was a game and a very deadly one. That's how I stayed alive. The readjustment into a civil society required we be more like the SheepDog and not the Wolf. We were no longer allowed to be predators.. Although that leap from Prey to Predator or sheepdog to wolf is a very fine line for some us and easy to cross, it is still necessary that some need reminding of our place in society and not to cross that line unless need dictates we do so. The hardest part is coming back across into the neutral zone. Now with all that said, most who get in shoots or have to take someones life on the street or in defense of themselves or loved ones, become victims themselves. With the Victim mentality before and after a deadly force encounter you most likely will have a hard time dealing with it. You cant help it, society has ingrained it you.

You see folks, there is a very dark and violent side to human nature. 98% of people dont know or fail to even recognize that its there much less acknowledge it. The have always been taught to keep it in the closet, never to be seen and when it does appear, they have no way of controlling it, nor even recognizing what it is. When that extreme violent side emerges, if it ever does, we feel ashamed..Now couple that with the Victim mentality and we've got a problem. This is a subject that I could go on and on about. Its learning to deal with a very dark violent side of our own human nature that most of us have been taught to ignore all our lives and in others its right beneath the surface. No matter if you are the perpetrator or the victim of a violent act, just dealing with the guilt will be the most difficult.
 

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Well said, Terry.
 

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Patient confidentiality does apply. However, the fact that you've seen a shrink can, in itself, be an issue in some things.
 

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I have chosen to carry a handgun for self-defense.

I know that there are evil people in our society, who will kill me for what I have, and will not bat an eye nor shed a tear at my fate.

I am aware that if I have to use my handgun to defend myself or my wife, and if I use my handgun properly, my attacker is going to die.

I have prepared myself mentally, for many years now, that if I have to take someone elses life to defend mine, then that person deserved his fate.

I seriously recommend that those here on this board, who are choosing to carry a handgun for self-defense, look deeply into your own soul and determine if you are truly prepared to use your handgun, if necessary, to take someone elses life in self-defense. This is no game, this is for keeps.

If you feel that you cannot use the handgun to take anothers life to defend yourself, then I recommend that you do NOT carry one. It can and will be turned on you by your attacker and used against you.

Will I need a psychologist if I have to use my handgun? At this time, I will say no.

How I respond to that question afterwards, if I ever do have to use my handgun to kill someone in self-defense, may change.

One thing I know for sure, if I have to use my handgun for self-defense and take someone's life, there will be no doubt in my mind that I did the right thing.
 

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Will I need a psychologist if I have to use my handgun? At this time, I will say no.

How I respond to that question afterwards, if I ever do have to use my handgun to kill someone in self-defense, may change.
Well said.
 

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Ooh-ooh pick me - pick me!!

I've been reading a lot. SwampRat - is the correct answer three?

MamaBear
Ding ding ding ding...we have a WINNER....:dancingbanana

#3 has been hanging around for 25 years. Just cant seem to run the ole blue hair off...
 

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Are we assuming that the nightmares being experienced by people are based on their remorse for shooting someone?

I ask because I once had some sleepless nights after having to help a friend who was outnumbered 3 vs 1 in a street brawl.

It wasn't because I regretted what I did, it was because I began to wonder what would have happened to my friend had I been even a few minutes later.......
 
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