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Why is it insane to hold a child committing a criminal act accountable? What do you favor, giving them a participation trophy?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Why is it insane to hold a child committing a criminal act accountable? What do you favor, giving them a participation trophy?
You don't see how this can be abused by the government?


I don't see how this isn't a clear violation of the 1st Amendment.
 

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Misleading subject line... of course.

The actual headline: Bill targets kids who post photos with an illegal firearm on social media

Read more here: https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article239958713.html#storylink=cpy
would allow police to arrest juveniles for illegal possession of firearms and charge them with a misdeameanor if they post their vanity videos and photos showing off their illegal weapons on social media.

Under the measure, police could make the arrest without a warrant, as long as there is probable cause to believe the young person has illegally possessed the weapons.
It’s against Florida law for anyone under age 18 to possess a firearm unless they are target shooting or hunting with an adult.
So, the question is.... how does law enforcement know (or suspect) the gun is "illegal?" I think this is just a way to get to known criminals or juveniles with a record sooner. I doubt very much that my photos of my girl with a gun will be targeted by LE.

 

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Misleading subject line... of course.

The actual headline: Bill targets kids who post photos with an illegal firearm on social media

Read more here: https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article239958713.html#storylink=cpy


So, the question is.... how does law enforcement know (or suspect) the gun is "illegal?" I think this is just a way to get to known criminals or juveniles with a record sooner. I doubt very much that my photos of my girl with a gun will be targeted by LE.

BINGO!!!!!!!!! "The bill would arrest kids for taking pictures with guns" is incorrect, it's kids with illegal guns. Once again, OP's reading comprehension is 3rd grade at best.
 

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BINGO!!!!!!!!! "The bill would arrest kids for taking pictures with guns" is incorrect, it's kids with illegal guns. Once again, OP's reading comprehension is 3rd grade at best.
It really bothers me the way you insult 3rd graders. :grin
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I doubt very much that my photos of my girl with a gun will be targeted by LE.
Your faith in government is quite disturbing. :thumbsdwn


Of course this will be abused. Every encroachment on TRTKBA is eventually pushed over the line and abused.
 

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Your faith in government is quite disturbing. :thumbsdwn


Of course this will be abused. Every encroachment on TRTKBA is eventually pushed over the line and abused.
Your ability to get subject matter correct in your posts is more disturbing.
 

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It has the exact same probability as any other law does of being abused. You're one of the few people I know who unfailingly look at a law first by it's abuse factor rather than what purpose the law actually fills.

As the article states, there is some correlation between youth violence and videos/photos posted on SM where the images serve as some kind of warning or challenge between parties that often leads to actual violence. So when little Billy decides to get on FB with some video in which he goes full gansta, it ought to prompt the question, "Where did Billy get that firearm he's waving all over the place while talking smack?"

Since Billy cannot buy one, and Billy cannot possess one, then it must be mom or dad just shooting a little footage just before they give Billy and his HiPoint a ride to his deer stand... that what you think is going on here? And you don't think a LEA has enough sense to see the difference between Billy bosting about zipping his competition and Billy in treebark cammo and orange hat posing with a deer?

This has better potential for a bigger nothingburger than all the crap you've promised we were going to see with Red Flag laws (and didn't). Yeah, this could be the sort of "Dave's Double with cheese" of sky-is-falling predictions. :grin
 

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Misleading subject line... of course.
Seriously. The consistency of this nonsense is just getting pathetically laughable.

To the OP, how can you NOT see what a laughing-stock you are turning yourself into? I don't know what your objective is in posting this sort of misleading rubbish, but I can pretty much assure you that you are not achieving it.
 

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Why would there need to be a bill to make an arrest for something that’s already illegal?

Police already use social media for investigative purposes.


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Why would there need to be a bill to make an arrest for something that’s already illegal?

Police already use social media for investigative purposes.


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Currently, the list in FS 901.15 of crimes a LEO can make an arrest for without a warrant doesn't include this particular crime. This bill adds it. So all it's basically doing is allowing for an arrest based on observation of posted photos/video being all the RAS needed for that arrest.
 

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Bill would arrest kids for taking pictures with guns

Currently, the list in FS 901.15 of crimes a LEO can make an arrest for without a warrant doesn't include this particular crime. This bill adds it. So all it's basically doing is allowing for an arrest based on observation of posted photos/video being all the RAS needed for that arrest.
I can’t see a picture alone holding up in court. Easy to say someone over 18 and legally able to own the firearm was in the background supervising.

I was thinking the picture would be used to identify who potentially is in illegal possession of a gun, the police would then investigate and upon discovering the firearm in their possession, make an arrest.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m all for getting gang bangers and Instagram gangstas off the streets.


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Corrected OP's misleading thread title AGAIN by using title of linked news article. :smack
 

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I don't think a picture or a video alone will result in a conviction either. I think it's going to take more of an investigative effort than just watching a video.

Where I think this bill tries to go is to allow an arrest based on probable cause rather than a warrant, because as you point out that warrant is going to need a lot more beef to it than simply saying some yute made himself the star of a gangsta video.

From the OP link, it appears there is some concern about not being able to act quickly enough to prevent a situation from escalating out of control. That seems to be why they want it to be an arrest based on RS rather than a warrant process, though I have doubts that if a LEA truly thought this was an urgent situation kind of thing that they couldn't expedite a warrant. So maybe the real reason is just to make it easier.

If a kid doing this is not truly committing a crime (fake gun, for example), then it doesn't matter if the arrest is warranted or warrantless - the facts will come out in the investigation and charges will be filed/dropped/never started based on what's found when investigated.

The OP is perpetually concerned about abuse and rights being preserved, and so from that angle I think this is actually a better approach and here's why. If it is only done via a warrant process, then once the warrant is issued the subject will be arrested on the spot, regardless of what is found and it will be sorted out later. This is consistent with what you see when someone is stopped for a traffic violation and has an active warrant - even if it's been addressed but the warrant is still active, it's bracelet time. If the arrest can be made based on RS, then what is found when the LEOs get there IS going to matter. If they find an inert, plastic gun and that's all it amounted to, then no arrest has to happen at all. In that case it would actually be better for the subject by not having to "undo" an arrest. So I can see some positive to this, though I'm sure the OP will view it through his typical lens of what the worse possible abuse by the worse possible LEO on the worse possible day could be rather than examine norms.
 

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What is an "illegal" firearm?
Possession of a pre or post sample Title II firearm without the necessary FFL & Class 02 or 03 SOT.

Or possession of a tranferrable Title II firearn without the applicable tax stamp applied to a ATF Form 1 or Form 4.
 

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Possession of a pre or post sample Title II firearm without the necessary FFL & Class 02 or 03 SOT.

Or possession of a transferable Title II firearm without the applicable tax stamp applied to a ATF Form 1 or Form 4.
Does that make the weapon illegal, or its possession?
 

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Bad grammar misrepresented threads, and other tits for tats.

This is more BS to get a gun grabbers foot further in the door to accidentally, wrongfully or purposely remover guns from the population and/or just make legal gun owns lives more difficult.
Not really worthy of fighting for yet, so what if a few legal gun owners are given a hard time or temporarily lose their rights, it's for everyone's own good.
 
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