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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
So far; that’s just EBL, but I don’t know how much longer he’ll be interested in continuing to do TFP training. He's the only instructor that I know of who Brownie’s given permission to teach the skills…
Anyone is capable of passing the torch of the 3 WW2 skills. QK pistol is mine, gave Rick permission to pass that torch as well.

Both EBL and I are 70, he may train once in a awhile for the next few years, but his involvement as a trainer, like mine, is near the end. And it would be advantageous to find someone 1/2 our age that would be able to travel to other parts of the US, not just locally in Fla. He's have to be vocal on other boards, be able to hold his own in heated discussion to advert the courses of fire.

Truth be told, the old guard is dead, the few touched by those old guard masters are long in the tooth at this point [ and not carrying the torch as it should be passed ]. I offered two students [ over the 18 years I did it ] the opportunity to become a protege' in the skills and carry the torch. It would require some time with me one on one to make that happen, never materialized
 

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Sounds like something needs to be done, quick and in a hurry.
or
This mystic lessons that were taught to youngsters in boot camp then sent to war with will begone forever. :oops:

How about a curriculum and franchise?
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Sounds like something needs to be done, quick and in a hurry.
or
This mystic lessons that were taught to youngsters in boot camp then sent to war with will begone forever. :oops:

How about a curriculum and franchise?
Curriculum is established, even the biggest training facilities aren't franchised. Franchising would, IMO, be a bad idea for one reason, that the skills would be watered down passed from one trainer to another. It happened within two years of the military adopting rifle QK. The trainers trained more trainers, and after two years, that ONE skill didn't resemble the actual skill set. They dropped the program stating it was no longer effective. Ya, effective as it was when we adopted it, but we changed that and now it doesn't work [ no kidding, when you change just a little something the masters developed, it's not as effective or made useless
 

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If standards can't be kept refuse to be held. It is a loss.
 
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Curriculum is established, even the biggest training facilities aren't franchised. Franchising would, IMO, be a bad idea for one reason, that the skills would be watered down passed from one trainer to another. It happened within two years of the military adopting rifle QK. The trainers trained more trainers, and after two years, that ONE skill didn't resemble the actual skill set. They dropped the program stating it was no longer effective. Ya, effective as it was when we adopted it, but we changed that and now it doesn't work [ no kidding, when you change just a little something the masters developed, it's not as effective or made useless
That’s kinda the old joke in class where the teacher whispers something in the first person‘s ear and that person turns around and repeats it to the next and so on. By the end of the class the word is nothing like it was when the first person was told it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #26 ·
That’s kinda the old joke in class where the teacher whispers something in the first person‘s ear and that person turns around and repeats it to the next and so on. By the end of the class the word is nothing like it was when the first person was told it.
Exactly, having been touched by one of the people that trained with the masters during WW2, they were at the time the only people who had the knowledge to pass them along. Figure the war ended in 45, he started his counter training facility in the late 70's, he had held that knowledge for 30 years before bringing it back to select students.

I held the knowledge from 81 till 06 [ another 25 years ] before bringing the skills back to the public. I trained others exactly the way my mentors trained their students. Same goes for defensive edged weapons I offered, imparted the exact same way [ format ] I received the training over 9 years with master at arms James Keating.

If I'd deviated from that in any way, it would have been watered down and not as effective.
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 · (Edited)
Brownie,
I told you a long time ago if you needed help with teaching classes to give me a call?
I didn't need the help, but it would have been nice to co-train again like we did in Va, Az. Now that I'm retired from training, people are looking for the next TF instructor to step up to the plate.

People are hoping that's you, or someone like you who has had the knowledge and can impart those skills correctly. I've retired now 3 times, enough is enough. Hell, I don't even shoot anymore except when my brother is here over the Xmas holiday. ;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #30 ·
Is there a thread with all the acronyms we use on this board? Maybe it can be updated with all the new ones as they're thought up.
what acronyms are you asking about. I know and have used most of them.
 

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We can agree to disagree on the help part however, the students at Easton, sightless 1&2 events, as well as Virginia all made out having both of us there.

With regard to the future, I am retiring this April so I will have plenty of time to teach. I have been busy with active shooter training and getting various govt buildings trained up, problems identified, and fixed etc.
 

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Discussion Starter · #32 · (Edited)
We can agree to disagree on the help part however, the students at Easton, sightless 1&2 events, as well as Virginia all made out having both of us there.

With regard to the future, I am retiring this April so I will have plenty of time to teach. I have been busy with active shooter training and getting various govt buildings trained up, problems identified, and fixed etc.
Agreed, even more so when the 3 of us set up camp on a range. Va. was the hardest course I've had in the 18 years of training due to the weather
 

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Mr. Murphy always seems to show up when I am training in Virginia.

I agree that day was cold, wet, and totally exhausting! Hats off to the students that didn't even complain once.

The last time I ran training at Little Creek firearm's range started out the same way only we had a wind coming off of the ocean as the range is right on the beach. However, the afternoon was absolutely beautiful and made it worthwhile.
 

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Brownie,
Are you out of it for good or just from being the lead instructor?

Seeing how I am soon to be retired and will have some real time on my hands, would you be interested in teaming up for a couple of classes?
 

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Discussion Starter · #36 ·
Brownie,
Are you out of it for good or just from being the lead instructor?

Seeing how I am soon to be retired and will have some real time on my hands, would you be interested in teaming up for a couple of classes?
I'm pretty much out now. Hell, I haven't shot out here but once a year for the last few myself, usually just one day with my brother who visits at Xmas.

But I appreciate you reaching out on this. Hopefully you can carry the torch for the next decade or more and get more trained up.

Hope you and the family are well. It's been awhile
 

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That is the thing about becoming an instructor for the government as you spend more time creating, planning, and executing classes then you spend actually shooting. It gets down right ridiculous when it comes to running a range on a military base.

My invitation is open ended as it would be good to do one more class together. It would give me one last chance to pick your brain and catch upon old times. Moreover, I get hear your stories about Mitch at lunnch. Hell, I don't mind doing all of the demonstrations either as it is hard to find someone with your experience to help run the line.
 

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Discussion Starter · #38 ·
That is the thing about becoming an instructor for the government as you spend more time creating, planning, and executing classes then you spend actually shooting. It gets down right ridiculous when it comes to running a range on a military base.

My invitation is open ended as it would be good to do one more class together. It would give me one last chance to pick your brain and catch upon old times. Moreover, I get hear your stories about Mitch at lunnch. Hell, I don't mind doing all of the demonstrations either as it is hard to find someone with your experience to help run the line.
Appreciate the thoughts. If the stars aligned where I could ride the motorcycle to a COF [ I won't fly anymore ] I'd be tempted. 5 years ago I got back on the motorcycles. I've made some multiple week long trips to places like Prudhoe bay [ 8K miles in 3 weeks ]; several 2 week trips into Wyoming, SD, Colorado, Montana, NM. My brother and I took the bikes to Mexico for Xmas this year.

It would be good to catch up and train together again after all these years however.
 

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Appreciate the thoughts. If the stars aligned where I could ride the motorcycle to a COF [ I won't fly anymore ] I'd be tempted. 5 years ago I got back on the motorcycles. I've made some multiple week long trips to places like Prudhoe bay [ 8K miles in 3 weeks ]; several 2 week trips into Wyoming, SD, Colorado, Montana, NM. My brother and I took the bikes to Mexico for Xmas this year.

It would be good to catch up and train together again after all these years however.
Well be sure to let us know if any CoF opportunities develop and I'll do my best to attend and I'm betting several more would, too! 🤠
 
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