Florida Carry Alleges Illegal Activities By The Charlotte County Sheriff’s Dept.
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Thread: Florida Carry Alleges Illegal Activities By The Charlotte County Sheriff’s Dept.

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    Distinguished Member Lautermilch's Avatar
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    Florida Carry Alleges Illegal Activities By The Charlotte County Sheriff’s Dept.


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    Article provides absolute zero about what exactly is being violated and it doesn't specify how. The only thing mentioned in the response letter from the SA's investigator was some emails that contained pictures of firearms and the name of the conveying customer that the SA determined do NOT constitute a list (registry) under FSS790.335. That statute specifically cites as exceptions "Firearm records, including paper pawn transaction forms and contracts on firearm transactions, required by chapters 538 and 539." Sounds remarkably like what the SA's investigator said.

    Once again Ammoland reports one single side of the story - the response - but won't give you the complaint side of the story so we can judge exactly what the SO is alleged to have done. Far as I'm concerned, if they want to hide it, there's no need for anyone to be concerned about it. If it has merit, then lay it out on the table so we can all see it.
    Last edited by OHEng; 10-09-2019 at 09:23 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by OHEng View Post
    Article provides absolute zero about what exactly is being violated and it doesn't specify how. The only thing mentioned in the response letter from the SA's investigator was some emails that contained pictures of firearms and the name of the conveying customer that the SA determined do NOT constitute a list (registry) under FSS790.335. That statute specifically cites as exceptions "Firearm records, including paper pawn transaction forms and contracts on firearm transactions, required by chapters 538 and 539." Sounds remarkably like what the SA's investigator said.

    Once again Ammoland reports one single side of the story - the response - but won't give you the complaint side of the story so we can judge exactly what the SO is alleged to have done. Far as I'm concerned, if they want to hide it, there's no need for anyone to be concerned about it. If it has merit, then lay it out on the table so we can all see it.
    I disagree with the above statements completely.
    Did you read the entirety of 790.335 and 538/539?

    It is very clear that a database of firearm owners is illegal.
    Yes - pawn shops must submit records of firearms being pawned.

    The Sheriff's office violated the law when they took multiple such records, (which presumably would have also included non-firearm transactions), from SEVERAL different pawn shops, over a period of time, and entered that information into a database when they then data-mined to extract only a list of firearms that had been pawned.

    Do you see the difference?
    A pawn shop could accept a gun as collateral for a loan, and then report it to the Sheriff's office.
    The Sheriff could then (without doing anything else) do whatever checks were needed to confirm that that particular pawned weapon was not implicated in any crimes, etc...
    Each check is made individually, with zero need to aggregate all such pawn shop reports into a centralized database. (And in fact, he need not have the owner's name, but we can table that here.)

    When the Sheriff collected all such records from all sources, on an ongoing basis, weeding it such that only firearms records remained -- then he has created a LIST of firearms owners, in direct violation of the Statutes. He could have done everything that needed doing without the list, and if you read the statutes with that knowledge and understanding, then the entirety of the Statue makes perfect sense.

    Bottom line: They are breaking the law.
    It's pretty clear to me, the way I read it. I am not an attorney, or a pre-law wanna-be.
    But I can read the plain language and parse it. The exception covers the transmission by the pawn shop. Period.
    It does not authorize the compiling of computerized lists of gun owners after the fact, by the Sheriff, as a consequence of being in possession of pawn transactions so reported.
    Last edited by Anduril; 10-09-2019 at 08:28 PM.

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    Distinguished Member High Seas Drifter's Avatar
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    I like Anduril's interpretation.

    Then again, as an executive member of Florida Carry, I feel like I have a dog in the hunt.

    Now that I've given full disclosure, I like Anduril's interpretation.



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    We will get all the facts that we need when the law suit is filed.

    Purdy has a reading comprehension problem or, just wants us to believe that he does not understand the complaint and hopes it will go away.

    His letter is non-responsive to the facts as we know them.

    All they need to do is destroy the prohibited data and promise to stop collecting more. No, that would be too easy.
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    Mr.L......; You seem to be unable to actually make narrative posts since all your posts are just links.
    And today you have about 10 new threads.
    I wonder.......are you under contract to the forum owners to boost the click count?????????
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    Senior Member mike_1950's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Fish View Post
    Mr.L......; You seem to be unable to actually make narrative posts since all your posts are just links.
    And today you have about 10 new threads.
    I wonder.......are you under contract to the forum owners to boost the click count?????????
    Don't take this wrong Fish not solely directed at you, to many members jumping on "another individual" for doing the same thing....knew it was just a matter of time before the SHTF on Lautermilch posting articles without many personal comments. If the subject matter does not interest me I do not open to view the content. Why is posting articles to promote conversation a bad thing? Also why is posting something of other than what the "experts in here" agree with a bad thing? Just because we all own guns does not make us always agree on everything that is posted. Each opinion is a personal, not a exact way of life. The trouble with this country right now is no opinion is viewed as exercising our rights under the 1st amendment, if it is not what the majority on hand wants to hear or see. No opinions are heard, absorbed, and evaluated for discussion and compromise by many in here and in the country in general. My way or the highway is getting us no place.
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    Distinguished Member The Fish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike_1950 View Post
    Don't take this wrong Fish not solely directed at you, to many members jumping on "another individual" for doing the same thing....knew it was just a matter of time before the SHTF on Lautermilch posting articles without many personal comments. If the subject matter does not interest me I do not open to view the content. Why is posting articles to promote conversation a bad thing? Also why is posting something of other than what the "experts in here" agree with a bad thing? Just because we all own guns does not make us always agree on everything that is posted. Each opinion is a personal, not a exact way of life. The trouble with this country right now is no opinion is viewed as exercising our rights under the 1st amendment, if it is not what the majority on hand wants to hear or see. No opinions are heard, absorbed, and evaluated for discussion and compromise by many in here and in the country in general. My way or the highway is getting us no place.
    Thanks Mike; It's just that we rarely hear what Mr. L himself has to say.
    I too open the links that interest me and leave the others alone.
    Some of the link sources amuse me like "South Florida Butt Kissers Journal" ???

    Or "United Douche Bags of America"
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    Well, I want to give a +1 to Laudermilch for his downright prolific postings!
    The vast majority are either on-topic, or close enough to be of interest to a forum like this.

    I was wondering where he gets all his leads.
    He'd probably make a hell of a private investigator... or "Special Counsel".

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