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Is a Pocket Gun “Enough” to Use in Self-Defense?

11K views 49 replies 21 participants last post by  wredlich 
#1 ·
https://www.usconcealedcarry.com/is-a-pocket-gun-enough/

Conclusions

Is a pocket gun enough? Data analysis indicates that a five-shot .38 probably holds enough ammunition to handle 70 percent of all likely situations. In the hands of a “low skill” shooter (anyone lacking training beyond the CHL level), the odds of getting acceptable hits are poor; that group averaged 57 percent on the test. When those two probabilities are multiplied to calculate total probability, the result is 40 percent, which isn’t great, but is better than 0 percent (no gun).


Thoughts?
 
#2 · (Edited)
Sounds about right. But a pocket pistol is generally NOT an effective combat weapon, especially against multiple attackers. Even a solid combat pistol is no match for a rifle or a shottie. And without training, practice and situational awareness, not much else matters, percentage-wise. but a pocket pistol with a little training can be far better than nothing. Just my humble opinion.
 
#3 ·
Also, you mentioned "hits".
I'm sure there are situations where a "pocket gun" is enough, even with hitting anything.

But to your point, I'm an transitioning from a S&W .380 Bodyguard to my Glock-26 (and maybe even 19).
The .380 is so small I hardly know I have it, but the truth is besides the underwhelming firepower, it's just too damn difficult to draw (and that's without the added stress).
 
#4 · (Edited)
It is a difficult question to answer. If I could, I'd carry a rifle or a pump shotgun together with a full sized high capacity .45 and would feel adequately armed for most scenarios. But, I can't do that for a variety of reasons. Many of us, due to occupation or other constraints, have a difficult time carrying anything larger than a small pocket pistol (in my case currently a Ruger LCP custom). That said, as I gain more experience I'm always looking at my options. I'm currently considering a Kahr CM-9, which is only slightly larger than the LCP and is a 9mm instead of a .380. The CM-9 is still a pocket pistol (at least in my view), but seems to be a better choice than the LCP for those of us who can't carry anywhere other than the pocket.
Any decision as to what to carry involves a series of tradeoffs. Where it all shakes out in the end will depend on each individual's unique set of circumstances. When I retire, the situation will change again and I'll probably gravitate to a larger, high capacity pistol. Time will tell.
 
#6 ·
Lots of variables and much depends on WHO is carrying it and under what conditions. I often carry a small 9mm and a 1911 with extra mags. At times however, just a small 9mm has to do with 9 rds and a spare.

Carry what you practice with and are comfortable with but something is always better than nothing.
 
#7 · (Edited)
I've been carrying my S&W 642 Airweight lately. So, I thought I should do some practice with it. It's NOT a fun range gun. At this last range session, I put 100 rounds through it, and that's a lot. It's punishing on the hand. At the same range session, I practiced with my Chiappa Rhino snubby.

I don't see any practical reason to do it at 25 yards other than curiosity, perhaps. So, I generally will practice with it at 5 - 7 yards. Both targets were done "threat focused," no sights. Rapid fire, "Mozambique" style (2, 1). From low-ready.

 
#8 ·
It should be about shot PLACEMENT. That is where the so called "stopping power" comes from. Even a .22 can kill, and has. I carry a G19 not for it being a 9mm but for the double stack magazine and the number of rounds I can fire before a tactical reload. If dress requirements force me to reduce the size of my EDC, it is my CM9 I go to for pocket carry. More narrow then a revolver. Same ammo as the G19. No other reason then that. Practice with what you carry, shot placement will make the difference.
 
#10 ·
Carry what you practice with and make sure you can hit what you're aiming at. After getting the Sig p320c in 9mm, that's what I carry. It points very natural to me and after a couple of matches, it's proven to be an incredibly accurate gun for me. I also have a Smith & Wesson Bodyguard that I carry when my attire and the size of the p320c makes it impractical to carry it. In those instances The Bodyguard gets carried iwb, pocket, or ankle depending on the situation. I have practiced with a Smith & Wesson enough to feel confident with it too. That particular 380 gun gets carried with an extra mag.
 
#11 ·
I wonder if I made everyone carry an lcp or similar 380, or a j frame snub in the pistol course, if people would then realize just how well they perform with a small pocket gun vs their sub/mid/full framed guns. From concealed, hands out of pockets like walking down the street would entail if one had to respond.

Might make for some interesting observations. I'm sure light bulbs would be going off, but in the opposite direction than is normally observed.
 
#12 ·
Not sure I'm following, so indulge my lack of clarity with more 'splainin', please. Are you suggesting some of us would do BETTER with a pocket-carried snubbie than a holstered (IWB or OWB) pistol?
 
#22 ·
My usual carry now is a 19 shot Wilson Combat/Beretta compact 9mm AND a NA .22 mag. There certainly are times when I can't carry the 9mm but I always have the .22 mag in my pocket. Again, there are other times - like court house appearances - where I can't even carry the .22....the feeling of being vulnerable and naked is very strong indeed.

I agree that the pocket gun certainly isn't a combat gun HOWEVER.....if things go into the sh*tter, my .22 mag will come in handy when I can smell the whiskey on his breath ..........
 
#23 ·
Certainly, a mouse gun is better than nothing. I think we can all agree on that. So if your choice is between a tiny pocket gun and nothing, then go with the pocket gun.

But I think most people underestimate what they can conceal. They carry the tiny pocket gun because they assume they can't conceal anything bigger. Most of the time, I would submit, this is a false assumption. I routinely wear a double-stack 9mm when dressed in shorts and a t-shirt, and have never had any problem; have never had anyone point and stare and say "He has a gun!"

And if I wear something where I really think the double-stack will be too obvious, then I carry a single-stack 9mm with a full-sized grip. There are precious darned few situations where you really MUST carry a tiny pocket gun in order to be able to effectively conceal your firearm. Not "none," I will grant you that, but precious darned few. Fewer than most people think.
 
#24 ·
I agree. I don't think I'd call the S&W 642 Airweight (.38-SPL+P) a "tiny" or "mouse" gun. My only reason for carrying it recently is a comfort issue. My pants shrunk! ;) I normally carry a Glock 27 IWB.
 
#30 ·
"...have never had anyone point and stare and say "He has a gun!" That you know of :) I have spotted CC a few times but don't normally say anything.
I'm pretty sure I would have known if anyone had ever shouted out "He has a gun!" I'm pretty sure I would have known if anyone had stopped, and stared, and pointed. I do have a little bit of situational awareness.

Have people looked at me and guessed that I was carrying a gun? I'm sure they have. I think it would be foolish to assume otherwise. Those who have, though, have just gone on about their business, like I have when I have noticed someone with a grip-shaped bulge under their shirt. For the people who notice, it is almost never an issue. Those for whom it would be an issue almost never notice.
 
#32 ·
This has probably been discussed many times here, but a .22 is a very deadly round. As a patrol deputy sheriff, my first homicide scene was a .22 vs. shotgun. I was first on scene as I was parked about 100 yards away writing reports.

A sawed-off shotgun killed the man of the house, and his son shot the intruder with a .22 rifle at very close range. The .22 round entered the perps chest cavity and bounced around, never exiting. Almost all vital organs were destroyed.
 
#33 ·
Wait a minute! Are you a reincarnation of deaheat!?!

Yes, a .22 CAN be deadly. You can kill an elephant with a .22, if you can manage to get the right shot placement. That doesn't make a .22 a good choice for elephant hunting. In fact, it is a horribly bad choice for elephant hunting.

It is also a horribly bad choice as a primary weapon for self defense. As a last-ditch backup? Fine. For a backup you use what you can. But if it is your first choice, as a primary self-defense weapon, when you could carry a larger caliber, then you are making a VERY poor choice, in my not-the-least-bit-humble opinion.
 
#37 ·
Maybe my reaction was oversensitive. I apologize for that. We used to have a member here who -- in all sincerity (as well as in all stupidity!) -- insisted that a .22 was perfectly fine as a self defense weapon, and no one really needed anything bigger. His oft-cited "proof" was the fact that Mossad agents frequently use .22s for assassinations. Um... Yeah, whatever.

Anyway, sorry if I over-reacted. I honestly wondered if that former member had returned with a new screen name.
 
#39 ·
nah, because it wouldn't be only the .22 as choice but claiming Call of Duty with visualization was the ultimate and only needed training tool...:grin
 
#41 ·
He sounds like he was an 'entertaining' individual. Whatever happened to him? And by the way, the only training you need to be a pilot is IL2 Sturmovik. Good luck! :grin
 
#40 ·
I used to play in "War Rooms" back in the 90's........it was a lot of fun......maybe some of you are familiar with them.....


.....sometimes this place reminds me of that.........personally, I really don't give a good bowel movement....I'm a 30+ year government employee with seniority and tenure and a contract, so not much gets to me........ but then there are times its discouraging when someone is just trying to share......
 
#42 ·
Usual EDC is a G26 with a 12 round mag. Carries very easy OWB at appendix. My bad area or long unfamiliar area carry is a G30 with a G21 13 round mag in a "Tommy's Gun Pack". A mouse gun is not for me. Never has anyone said after a gun fight, I had too much ammo.
 
#43 ·
I think it's important to not conflate the terms "pocket gun" and "mouse gun."

Mouse guns are always pocket guns. But, pocket guns are not always mouse guns.

At least when I think of "mouse guns," I think of "mouse calibers".... .22, .25, .32, and maybe even .380.

But, I wouldn't classify .38-SPL as a "mouse caliber." Therefore not a mouse gun. But, a S&W 642 Airweight can definitely be a pocket pistol.

Am I wrong?
 
#50 ·
I pocket carry a Glock 26 with 10+1 and almost always with two extra mags (12 rounds each).

I tried smaller 9mm and didn't like the felt recoil. My hands would hurt. I can shoot the G26 all day (and have done so at a couple training exercises) and the recoil doesn't bother me.

I generally buy cargo shorts or cargo pants (Propper brand on Amazon is my favorite). When I'm shopping I look for the size of the pocket. If the pockets are small, they're out.

Maybe this works for me because I'm 6 feet tall and over 200 pounds. With smaller size clothing it might not work as well.
 
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